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	<title>Comments on: Party! (Bohemians welcome!)</title>
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	<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/</link>
	<description>Blogging politics, culture, sociology and life from Brisvegas</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 20:26:27 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	
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		<title>By: Mindy</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-73148</link>
		<dc:creator>Mindy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 May 2006 10:06:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-73148</guid>
		<description>Rob - the question I would like you to answer is what has the current government done in the last 10 years to help the Aboriginal people, such as those who haunt the streets of Alice Springs? The two years we just spent there were certainly educational and eye opening. I worked for a not for profit organisation which involved among other things helping people in town camps but we really couldn&#039;t do much. Provide a few blankets, maybe a bed for someone bedridden, a fridge or a washing machine to be shared by a number of families, some second hand clothes. Hardly even a bandaid solution. 

My perception is all that has been done is pull Keith out of the woodwork to explain historically why it isn&#039;t the government&#039;s job to do anything because they aren&#039;t responsible for the mess in the first place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rob &#8211; the question I would like you to answer is what has the current government done in the last 10 years to help the Aboriginal people, such as those who haunt the streets of Alice Springs? The two years we just spent there were certainly educational and eye opening. I worked for a not for profit organisation which involved among other things helping people in town camps but we really couldn&#8217;t do much. Provide a few blankets, maybe a bed for someone bedridden, a fridge or a washing machine to be shared by a number of families, some second hand clothes. Hardly even a bandaid solution. </p>
<p>My perception is all that has been done is pull Keith out of the woodwork to explain historically why it isn&#8217;t the government&#8217;s job to do anything because they aren&#8217;t responsible for the mess in the first place.</p>
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		<title>By: Graham Bell</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-73137</link>
		<dc:creator>Graham Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 May 2006 09:41:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-73137</guid>
		<description>Liam said: ==&quot;Having been to the Berlin JÃ¼dischemuseum I can inform anybody on this thread still interested that the Nazi period actually forms a pretty small part of the exhibits. Itâ€™s a vast musuem that covers about one and a half thousand years of European Jewish diaspora&quot;

Wow! A public display that does not ignore 1480 years - or thereabouts - of rich cultural heritage ..... that must have upset Hollywood.  (b.t.w. the Holocaust display at the Imperial War Museum in London was an excellent, very informative and dignified display of what happened in the other 20 years).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Liam said: ==&#8221;Having been to the Berlin JÃ¼dischemuseum I can inform anybody on this thread still interested that the Nazi period actually forms a pretty small part of the exhibits. Itâ€™s a vast musuem that covers about one and a half thousand years of European Jewish diaspora&#8221;</p>
<p>Wow! A public display that does not ignore 1480 years &#8211; or thereabouts &#8211; of rich cultural heritage &#8230;.. that must have upset Hollywood.  (b.t.w. the Holocaust display at the Imperial War Museum in London was an excellent, very informative and dignified display of what happened in the other 20 years).</p>
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		<title>By: Sacha</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72986</link>
		<dc:creator>Sacha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2006 10:47:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72986</guid>
		<description>&quot;I suffer from the historianâ€™s debilitating handicap of actually wanting to read every tag and look closely at every exhibit in any museum I go to.&quot;

Liam, I&#039;m exactly the same! It&#039;s my default - I&#039;m trying to connect more to my emotions in museums (eg breaking away from boring exhibits), but it&#039;s hard to break a habit.

Mr T is exactly the opposite. He&#039;s motivated by what he thinks looks good - if it looks beautiful he might read the little label. If it doesn&#039;t look beautiful he may consider asking the curator that it be removed.

Mr T is usually in the museum shop/cafe before I am. (Some of these words are verbatim from Mr T himself).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I suffer from the historianâ€™s debilitating handicap of actually wanting to read every tag and look closely at every exhibit in any museum I go to.&#8221;</p>
<p>Liam, I&#8217;m exactly the same! It&#8217;s my default &#8211; I&#8217;m trying to connect more to my emotions in museums (eg breaking away from boring exhibits), but it&#8217;s hard to break a habit.</p>
<p>Mr T is exactly the opposite. He&#8217;s motivated by what he thinks looks good &#8211; if it looks beautiful he might read the little label. If it doesn&#8217;t look beautiful he may consider asking the curator that it be removed.</p>
<p>Mr T is usually in the museum shop/cafe before I am. (Some of these words are verbatim from Mr T himself).</p>
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		<title>By: Lefty Elitist</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72868</link>
		<dc:creator>Lefty Elitist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2006 06:59:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72868</guid>
		<description>I think thats right, Naomi, and its mentioned somewhere in that HREOC report.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think thats right, Naomi, and its mentioned somewhere in that HREOC report.</p>
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		<title>By: Lefty Elitist</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72851</link>
		<dc:creator>Lefty Elitist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2006 05:54:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72851</guid>
		<description>Well, 10 years into &quot;practical&quot; reconcilation with some of the worst life expectancy figures in the Western world *even when compared to other indigenous peoples*, Id say the jury hasnt even been appointed. 

Frankly, the improvements in the US, Canada and NZ over the last 30 years are a grave indictment on Australian (bi-partisan) inaction. 


See here, relevant tract below: 
http://www.hreoc.gov.au/social_justice/statistics/

(e) Life expectancy - Comparison with other indigenous peoples
Approximately thirty years ago, life expectancy rates for indigenous peoples in Canada, New Zealand and the United States of America were similar to the rates for Indigenous peoples in Australia. However, significant gains in life expectancy have been made in the past two decades in the indigenous populations in Canada, New Zealand and the United States of America. Comparable mortality rates for Aborigines and Torres Strait Islanders in 1990-1994 were at or above the rates observed 20 years ago in Maori and Native Americans, being 1.9 times the rate in Maori, 2.4 times the rate in Native Americans, and 3.2 times the rate for all Australians. 

Australia has fallen significantly behind in improving the life expectancy of its Indigenous peoples. Although comparisons should be made with caution (because of the way different countries calculate life expectation) data suggests Indigenous males in Australia live between 8.8 and 13.5 years less than indigenous males in Canada, New Zealand and the USA. Indigenous females in Australia live between 10.9 and 12.6 years less than indigenous females in these countries[57].</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, 10 years into &#8220;practical&#8221; reconcilation with some of the worst life expectancy figures in the Western world *even when compared to other indigenous peoples*, Id say the jury hasnt even been appointed. </p>
<p>Frankly, the improvements in the US, Canada and NZ over the last 30 years are a grave indictment on Australian (bi-partisan) inaction. </p>
<p>See here, relevant tract below:<br />
<a href="http://www.hreoc.gov.au/social_justice/statistics/" rel="nofollow">http://www.hreoc.gov.au/social_justice/statistics/</a></p>
<p>(e) Life expectancy &#8211; Comparison with other indigenous peoples<br />
Approximately thirty years ago, life expectancy rates for indigenous peoples in Canada, New Zealand and the United States of America were similar to the rates for Indigenous peoples in Australia. However, significant gains in life expectancy have been made in the past two decades in the indigenous populations in Canada, New Zealand and the United States of America. Comparable mortality rates for Aborigines and Torres Strait Islanders in 1990-1994 were at or above the rates observed 20 years ago in Maori and Native Americans, being 1.9 times the rate in Maori, 2.4 times the rate in Native Americans, and 3.2 times the rate for all Australians. </p>
<p>Australia has fallen significantly behind in improving the life expectancy of its Indigenous peoples. Although comparisons should be made with caution (because of the way different countries calculate life expectation) data suggests Indigenous males in Australia live between 8.8 and 13.5 years less than indigenous males in Canada, New Zealand and the USA. Indigenous females in Australia live between 10.9 and 12.6 years less than indigenous females in these countries[57].</p>
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		<title>By: Liam</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72844</link>
		<dc:creator>Liam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2006 05:21:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72844</guid>
		<description>Having been to the Berlin JÃ¼dischemuseum I can inform anybody on this thread still interested that the Nazi period actually forms a pretty small part of the exhibits. It&#039;s a vast musuem that covers about one and a half thousand years of European Jewish diaspora. It&#039;s so big, in fact, that there&#039;s a little Kosher coffee shop conveniently placed about halfway (about the year 1650) with cushions, benches to sit on and cake. Seriously.
It&#039;s pretty hard to work out the architectural design from the inside unless you know it&#039;s there. Luckily, there are no end of helpful booklets in twenty languages pointing it out.
...
I suffer from the historian&#039;s debilitating handicap of actually wanting to read every tag and look closely at every exhibit in any museum I go to. As a result I find museum-going of whatever kind totally exhausting and generally, I hate it.
That colours my reaction to the NMA in Canberra---by the time I left I felt like I&#039;d done fifteen rounds of nostalgia with somebody&#039;s grandpa.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having been to the Berlin JÃ¼dischemuseum I can inform anybody on this thread still interested that the Nazi period actually forms a pretty small part of the exhibits. It&#8217;s a vast musuem that covers about one and a half thousand years of European Jewish diaspora. It&#8217;s so big, in fact, that there&#8217;s a little Kosher coffee shop conveniently placed about halfway (about the year 1650) with cushions, benches to sit on and cake. Seriously.<br />
It&#8217;s pretty hard to work out the architectural design from the inside unless you know it&#8217;s there. Luckily, there are no end of helpful booklets in twenty languages pointing it out.<br />
&#8230;<br />
I suffer from the historian&#8217;s debilitating handicap of actually wanting to read every tag and look closely at every exhibit in any museum I go to. As a result I find museum-going of whatever kind totally exhausting and generally, I hate it.<br />
That colours my reaction to the NMA in Canberra&#8212;by the time I left I felt like I&#8217;d done fifteen rounds of nostalgia with somebody&#8217;s grandpa.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72837</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2006 04:44:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72837</guid>
		<description>Thanks for that, Naomi.  I don&#039;t really disagree with what you say save for the last point. I think the jury is in.

Have you read Rosemary Neil&#039;s &#039;Whiteout&#039;? Lousy title, but a very interesting book.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for that, Naomi.  I don&#8217;t really disagree with what you say save for the last point. I think the jury is in.</p>
<p>Have you read Rosemary Neil&#8217;s &#8216;Whiteout&#8217;? Lousy title, but a very interesting book.</p>
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		<title>By: Kim</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72786</link>
		<dc:creator>Kim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 May 2006 00:55:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72786</guid>
		<description>And the positive contribution Windschuttle is making to the present situation of Indigenous people is?

I think Lefty E&#039;s right - it&#039;s got much more to do with intra-White Australian Left/Right stoushes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And the positive contribution Windschuttle is making to the present situation of Indigenous people is?</p>
<p>I think Lefty E&#8217;s right &#8211; it&#8217;s got much more to do with intra-White Australian Left/Right stoushes.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72756</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:39:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72756</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s by way of answer to weathergirl.

Apologies for the heat. But I live in Alice Springs, and I see the results of the past generation&#039;s failed policies every time I step outside.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s by way of answer to weathergirl.</p>
<p>Apologies for the heat. But I live in Alice Springs, and I see the results of the past generation&#8217;s failed policies every time I step outside.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72751</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72751</guid>
		<description>That there never was a genocide, nor anything resembling it. That the colonisal authorities did everything in their power to protect the Aborigines. That they punished those who preyed upon them (and that&#039;s not to deny the black episodes). That generations of missionaries dedicated their lives to the education and welfare of Aborigines (only to be labelled genocidal murderers by the authors of Bringing Them Home). That, more recently, hundreds of millions of dollars have been poured from government coffers to support and sustain them. That, finally, we are belatedly realising what a farce was the Coombsian presciption for an idyllic hunter-gatherer return-to-the-future dreamtime for indigenous Australians, and are getting on with some practical solutions instead.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That there never was a genocide, nor anything resembling it. That the colonisal authorities did everything in their power to protect the Aborigines. That they punished those who preyed upon them (and that&#8217;s not to deny the black episodes). That generations of missionaries dedicated their lives to the education and welfare of Aborigines (only to be labelled genocidal murderers by the authors of Bringing Them Home). That, more recently, hundreds of millions of dollars have been poured from government coffers to support and sustain them. That, finally, we are belatedly realising what a farce was the Coombsian presciption for an idyllic hunter-gatherer return-to-the-future dreamtime for indigenous Australians, and are getting on with some practical solutions instead.</p>
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		<title>By: Lefty Elitist</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72750</link>
		<dc:creator>Lefty Elitist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:17:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72750</guid>
		<description>Well, change the roof design, and lose the motif, whatever! A white curator&#039;s museum representation hardly matters a toss to Indigenous people, I suspect. 

So, is this just an intra-Anglo left/right culture war issue for you? Pretty irrelevant aspect, Rob. How about the bigger picture - recognition of the systematic mistreatment of our indigenous fellow Australians?

Jeez, maybe then we could all move on. This is just pissing about with distractions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, change the roof design, and lose the motif, whatever! A white curator&#8217;s museum representation hardly matters a toss to Indigenous people, I suspect. </p>
<p>So, is this just an intra-Anglo left/right culture war issue for you? Pretty irrelevant aspect, Rob. How about the bigger picture &#8211; recognition of the systematic mistreatment of our indigenous fellow Australians?</p>
<p>Jeez, maybe then we could all move on. This is just pissing about with distractions.</p>
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		<title>By: weathergirl</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72749</link>
		<dc:creator>weathergirl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:16:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72749</guid>
		<description>Actually, Rob, please don&#039;t answer. I&#039;ve heard it all before, in the echo-chamber of Quadrant ideologues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, Rob, please don&#8217;t answer. I&#8217;ve heard it all before, in the echo-chamber of Quadrant ideologues.</p>
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		<title>By: weathergirl</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72748</link>
		<dc:creator>weathergirl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:14:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72748</guid>
		<description>And your objections to this are... ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And your objections to this are&#8230; ?</p>
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		<title>By: weathergirl</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72747</link>
		<dc:creator>weathergirl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:13:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72747</guid>
		<description>And your objections to this are...?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And your objections to this are&#8230;?</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72746</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:11:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72746</guid>
		<description>The exhibits in the First Australians galleries powerfully attest to the holocaust connection. They speak constantly of a relationship with white Australia whose signature was genocide (and an  assimilation which was a &#039;second order&#039; genocide) and brutal oppression. That&#039;s consistent with the architectural design.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The exhibits in the First Australians galleries powerfully attest to the holocaust connection. They speak constantly of a relationship with white Australia whose signature was genocide (and an  assimilation which was a &#8217;second order&#8217; genocide) and brutal oppression. That&#8217;s consistent with the architectural design.</p>
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		<title>By: Sacha</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72741</link>
		<dc:creator>Sacha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 15:01:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72741</guid>
		<description>If a design is brilliant, then it should be used for inspiration!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If a design is brilliant, then it should be used for inspiration!</p>
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		<title>By: Kim</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72737</link>
		<dc:creator>Kim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 14:55:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72737</guid>
		<description>So it was a statement by the architect, Rob?

If that&#039;s so, and if Casey didn&#039;t know about it (and I&#039;ve never heard of Liebeskind - admittedly she might be more expected to - but there&#039;s no reason to presume she did against her word), why would it be something that reflected on those who designed the exhibits?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So it was a statement by the architect, Rob?</p>
<p>If that&#8217;s so, and if Casey didn&#8217;t know about it (and I&#8217;ve never heard of Liebeskind &#8211; admittedly she might be more expected to &#8211; but there&#8217;s no reason to presume she did against her word), why would it be something that reflected on those who designed the exhibits?</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72736</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 14:55:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72736</guid>
		<description></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the Encyclopaedia Brittanica:</p>
<p>&#8220;When the new National Museum of Australia (NMA) debuted in March in Canberra following 20 years of planning, it opened to mixed reviews. Though some praised architect Howard Raggatt&#8217;s design as a â€œmasterpiece,â€? others deemed the design plagiarized from the Jewish Museum Berlin, which, though it opened in September, had been completed two years earlier. Aerial photographs comparing the two museums had disclosed a disturbingly similar zigzag shape. The director of the NMA, Dawn Casey, maintained that the design was â€œbrilliant,â€? and she downplayed the similarity of the roof designs.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72734</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 14:51:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72734</guid>
		<description>No, that&#039;s a fact, Kim. You&#039;re unlikely to regard KW as reliable source, so I&#039;ll try to find another. Former NMA director Dawn Casey said she didn&#039;t know about it until it was too late, or similar.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, that&#8217;s a fact, Kim. You&#8217;re unlikely to regard KW as reliable source, so I&#8217;ll try to find another. Former NMA director Dawn Casey said she didn&#8217;t know about it until it was too late, or similar.</p>
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		<title>By: Kim</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/comment-page-2/#comment-72728</link>
		<dc:creator>Kim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 May 2006 14:46:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2006/05/04/party-bohemians-welcome/#comment-72728</guid>
		<description>Is that a fact, Rob, or a supposition?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is that a fact, Rob, or a supposition?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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