Yes it’s time again for mate against mate, state against state, the cockroaches against the cane toads, the maroons against the blues as Queensland and New South Wales line up again for the first of Rugby League’s annual State of Origin stoushes tonight.
They say the Suncorp Stadium is no longer “the cauldron� that once was Lang park and visiting teams love playing here.
We Quincelanders do need to win, because the second match is at Telstra Australia in Sydney and the record shows we’ve never won there. (Well we did win a couple of times, it’s just that the ref didn’t score it that way.)
Queensland are said to be favourites, but the Blues are confident. To be honest, I’m never the slightest bit confident. How could one be? The record shows that these games are often decided by centimetres.
There have been 25 series. NSW has won 12, Qld 11 with 2 drawn.
We’ve played 77 games. Qld has won 38, NSW 37 and 2 drawn.
NSW has scored 1,242 points to Qld’s 1236.
Qld has scored 216 tries to NSW’s 212.
One match was played in Los Angeles in 1987, an exhibition match which NSW won 30-18. If you took that one out of the statistics, as I believe we should, the games, points and tries tallies tip slightly more towards Qld.
Mat Rogers who has done everything in Union and League reckons it’s simply the toughest footie you’ll find.
Tough, it will be, but whether it’s an open, fast, attractive contest depends, as Warren Ryan said today, on whether the ref allows a wrestling match in the tackles. Again it is a matter of split seconds.
Anyway, no blogging for me tonight for a couple of hours. Let the war begin!
Blogging here from Sea Eagles territory, I must say that with Locky and Thurston as five-eighth and half, Queensland should win this one, particularly as Monaghan has been left out of the NSW side. The Blues have nothing comparable excpet for Buderus in hooker position. I blame Fulton. Monners has been given a rough trot at Manly as well. It is a shame and some behind-the-scenes bastardry that will cost both Manly and NSW dearly.
Whoever wins the forward battle will win the game. If the NSW pack gets a roll on Mullen will do the job. Otherwise the Thurston/Lockyer show will be on.
Nah, nah, it will be strategic kicks.
Let the war begin indeed.
I’ll be on the lookout for the quality of swings in the inevitable touchups. If anyone can do better than Willy Mason’s effort on Stuart Fielden in the last Aus-GB Test, I’ll be very impressed.
A game of football, you say?
More fun would be the Amnesty International forum in Brisbane on anti-terror legislation and the need for a Bill of Rights.
Premier’s Hall in Parliament House. 6:30 - 8:30pm.
Hopefully neither a maroon or blue football jersey in sight.
Queensland might be set for a period of domination again especially looking at their backline. Steve Price for me is the most underated forward in the game and one of the great forwards of the last decade. No matter how tough the defence is, he just keeps rolling forward and can pop a great pass at the right time.
Queensland by ten I reckon.
And a trackback.
You’re a good little pre-match analyst, Kenny Scott, but have failed to address the Brain Explosion Factor. To be winners on the night, a top head trainer is as essential as an on-field general. Lowers the BEF rate.
Roy and H.G. should be doing the honours on JJJ. On song, they are comedic bards. If they don’t fire up by the 20 minute mark of the first half, it’s over to the wry, street-wise lyricism of Raymond “Rabbits” Warren, I’m afraid. Wonder if Rabs will be able to restrain himself from referring to Houdini? These are matters of great cultural significance.
Blues by 4.
I just hope the Maroons are down at half-time, so we can relive that magic (if slightly retarded when viewed out of context) Fatty Vautin moment
“KWEEEEEEEENSLANDAHHHHHHHHH!”
Incidentally, my partner likes me to yell that out in bed. Really gets her motor runnin. And I bet she’s not the only one, ay, Quinceland ladies?
Well, Lefty, there’s nothing sexier than that Darren Lockyer rasp. Am I the only one who’d like to hear him singing “Falling In Love Again”?
Get it right, Lefty. It was Billy Moore, in the tunnel, at the start of the first game in the 1995 series.
Cattle dog!
Thats right…. I stand corrected!
Didnt he have a head wound at the time, for maximum effect?
You’re on, Shaun.
jings, here’s a barney!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vdQrAvLH2k
Travelling back in time now, can someone pls explain this chant to me. I learnt it on the bus home after playing an under 12 league match in 1980. I never knew who these people were, but it went:
” GRA-ham Edie..(clap clap clapclapclap) … TOM-my Mooney …. JOHN -ny Doherty… etc”
Not in the tunnel but later he got a little tap and had his head wrapped to staunch the flow of sauce. Of course, Lefty, Paul Vautin will remain famous for his prespicacious character analysis of Piers Akerman, during a televised press conference for the NRL (conducted by Vautin), about the famous Super League debacle. Akers pretended to be a disinterested pressman, whereas he was there as an agent provocateur of News Ltd, the promoter of the short-lived rival code, Super League.
When Vautin wound down the press conference, Akers objected: “Now look here. I haven’t finished asking my questions…”
Vautin: “Ah yeah? And who are you, you fat bag of shit?”
Yes, that sums up Piers rather well, and concisely.
Despite not being a big fan of the code, I must admit I found the League version of the Footy Show pretty much compulsory viewing for a while. Vautin just cracks me up.
Perhaps Fatty’s only lasting claim to fame. But I suppose he was a good player and he did coach Quinceland to an unexpected origin victory.
The Footy Show is unwatchable and has been for years.
Yes. Fatty’s got it nailed. There I was toying around with ‘Ackwit’, trying to be polite mind you, but “fat bag of shit” it is.
It’s part of media history now CK
CLICK
Kelly Higgins-Devine who presents Drive on local radio went right off her brain today to presenter Richard Fidler about people putting up blue balloons along with the maroon in the shopping centre. TOTAL OUTRAGE!
The joke is, of course, that they are both ex Victoria and probably hadn’t heard of Rugby League until they left.
Kelly had a bit of fun with people ringing up and maintaining the rage until a woman rang up and reminded her that it was about State of Origin and there are quite a few of the enemy within. She was one. She married a Quincelander and three more emerged from her loins, but she couldn’t/wouldn’t change.
Why, then, did Peter Sterling play for NSW?
I agree with Shaun’s analysis of the game, actually. I’m a bit worried about Justin Hodges, because he needs an operation on his knee and hasn’t been stepping all that well lately.
The NSW players have a size advantage across the park, but we can’t rely on them tiring. Hope it isn’t decided by a field goal, unless it’s our way.
Brian, this is the Modern Game, it will be too fast to be won in the forwards. It is not raining. The game will be won with pinpoint kicking and putting well positioned runners into holes. Although I am a New South Welshman, I do believe that Queensland will take this one out, no trouble at all, with Thurston and Locky directing the play. I put my money where my mouth is and I am going to relieve Enemy Combie of his hard earned crash. And I am only sorry that his poor little daughter will be eating gruel all next week.
Ken, according to Warren Ryan the modern game is largely about territory and that depends principally on holding down in tackles, kicking, spilling the pill, and penalties. Yes and running and passing have a bit to do with it too, but mainly when you are at the money end.
Go Mullo!
If your forwards are going forward your kicker gets more time and space as well as kicking from a more favourable position at the end of each set. If your forwards are going forward your backline gets more time and space. The game is still won or lost on the ability of the forward pack to dominate their opposition. The forwards are just a lot more mobile these days than they use to be.
Liveblogging of Origin is happening.
And what Brian and Kapunda have said. No go forward and you can forget about your kicking game.
Bunch of losers. AFL is the only game in town and if any of you had any sense you’d be barracking for the Dockers. Harumph.
Game over. Qld won. Nevertheless it was a ref’s game.
Price was awarded one try but (unfairly) denied another. On the other hand, NSW was awarded a try but the evidence suggests there was no grounding.
As Shaun said above, whoever wins the forward game will win the game. So true.
Locky was fantastic, as was Thurston, Price and PC.
Overall, a good game, but could have been a lot better if there was more use of the video ref.
Steven Price was my man of the match. What a great game he and Petro played. Queensland realy got it right after half time and if they can play 80 minutes like that in the next one I think NSW will struggle to hold them.
Yep, I named Price as my MOM though Thurston was great as well. Bloody NSW threw it away in the second half and that was before Hayne’s blunder.
The problem is that Murray doesn’t play Hindy enough.
Shaun said:
.
I can only agree. SP and PC were fantastic as were DL and JT.
The margin should have been greater but I agree that NSW played well.
Look guys, I don’t get any pleasure from saying this, but my comments were vindicated by the events. BTW jattyd Hynes and the full game is already posted on wiki. The world is changing before our very own eyes, folks.
I backed Queensland, and for one overwhelminf reason: Jonathan Thurston. Who will rival the King, and Johnsy, maybe even surpass them. Thurston’s and Lockyer’s kicks made the difference, not the forwards. A kick that returns possession is by far the yardage getter than all the forwards in the world. With two long range guns like Locky and Thurston NSW had no answer.
Good kicking requires quick play the balls. Quick play the balls are the result of going over the advatage line and either standing in the tackle or falling face down so you can get to your feet quickly. That is what Price and Petro did. You can’t have a good kicking game without your forwards being on top.
Woohoo!
Yes, Thurston and Lockyer’s kicking game would have been ordinary without the platform the forwards laid in the 2nd half.
Kapunda, I do agree about the forwards going forward. That’s why I didn’t agree with Qld kicking after the 4th tackle as they sometimes did. It usually ended up with NSW taking their first tackle at the 30 metre line, which inevitably means they’ll be in an attacking position at the end of their set.
But the real territorial gains come from penalties and mistakes. I think all the scoring came from the set following penalties or mistakes by the other team.
For the record Qld won 25-18 with a vigorous second half effort after trailing 18-6 at half-time.
Unfortunately there were a few refereeing howlers the worst of which the ABC report describes as follows:
I thought Anasta’s pass was forward as well, but they often let them go when they are marginal.
Not so, though, when Price went over the first time.
I wonder whether Simpkins will get the gig for the next one.
Brian, the point I was trying to make was that if your forwards are being driven sideways or back and your play the balls are slow, it is hard to get any sort of kick away, especialy if the markers are getting out of the gates quickly. I was not really commenting on the game itself just trying to point out to Ken that the forwards do lay the platform whether he is aware of it or not is another thing.
I agree both those decisions were wrong and realy provided a 12 point turn around. It is hard to see how he let Anastas pass go and pulled up Price. QLD hit their straps in the second half and looked by far the better team and if they play up to that in Sydney they should win, barring refereeing accidents.
Kapunda, I agree entirely.
Telstra Stadium is likely to be slippery. They don’t know how to produce a good surface down there, so it’ll be a different game.
I agree that forwards play a part etc etc. In my view, neither of the forwards packs dominated the other. But Thurston dominated his opposite number and was always unpredictable. His kicks either into the arms of a winger or through to the ingoal area, trapping NSW, were nearly always on the money.
There was some ordinary execution by Queensland receivers and runners but that is because they couldn’t think that fast and this is in part lack of maturity on the part of Thurston. Anyway, if you discount a try per each side for gross mistakes, Queensland was on top tactically. I may add, they were in twice but couldn’t finish or a pass was forward. The point is they were in a scoring position, and this sue to kicks and passes.
If one side over-relies on hitups by the forwards and the other side kicks very accurately and strategically and often then towards the end of the game the running forwards will get slower and slower. And if you rely on that as a tactic - platform if you like, then this is platform collapses. This is what happened.
Just watching the replay on Foxtel and Cameron Smiths kicking game was pretty fair too. He has a real edge on Buderis in that area.
Ken, your last post told me all I need to know about your knowledge of the game. We will agree to disagree but you won’t find a single person who has played or coached the game at a decent level that would agree with your theory.
QUINCELANDAHHHHHH!
What wpd said.
The papers have made Hayne the scapegoat for NSW’s loss which is a distortion of the game. Take that blunder out he had a blinder. He was not responsible for NSW insipid defence that allowed QLD back in the game in the 2nd half.
There were two tries to QLD due the mistakes in defence by Matt King, arguably just as bad as Hayne’s pass in the context of the game.
I agree that QLD would probably have won regardless of Haynes mistake. They were squarely on top in the second half. But as far as mistakes go it was a top drawer effort and inexcusable at that level. Making a mistake in defence is one thing, but throwing the ball for the QLD skipper to wander in under the posts is in a different catergory of mistake altogether.
Look on the bright side though, he will learn from this and probably never do it again and he most likely will be available for Parra during the next origin game.
Kapunda,
I do not know what you are on about. My comments are neither radical, nor news to anyone who is familiar with the game. I predicted the outcome to Brian before the game started - see up the thread. I also correctly predicted the pattern of the game.
For the record, my knowledge of rugby league is as a player, coach, manager and now a director of a local rugby league club. I have played rugby league from the age of 10 to the age of 27. I have been an official at my club for the last 16 years. I have represented my district in the Jersey Flegg, President’s Cup, and SG Ball comps (as has my son, more recently).
If Hayne is dropped it will be a mistake as he was one of NSW’s best and showed poise and determination after the blunder which was a good sign.
There are few other players that should go before Hayne.
I got the gist of what I was up against in your previous post so I would like to leave it there and agree to disagree.
My last post was directed at Ken of course.
Hayne did play well no doubt if you put aside that major blunder. I don’t know whether they will drop him or not but I’m sure the mistake wil be used to push the claims of some other wingers around the place.
Now there’s an unappealing image.
The changes NSW should be looking at are actually in there pack. In the second half QLD rolled out of trouble too easily while the likes of Kite, White and Simpson just didn’t get the same roll forward for NSW. It was clear to me that the QLD forwards had control in the second half mainly on the back SP and PC who showed they were still Australias best prop forwards. Whether NSW has the alternatives in the forward pack is the question but surely they must look at Ryan Hoffman.
On Hayne, you could compare him with Tate whose mistakes, one a howler in defence, cost at least two tries.
Warren Ryan didn’t ping Tate for the kick that led to Hayne’s try BTW. He said it was fair enough to try the kick in behind Hayne at that point. You could also ping Hodges for missing the tackle.
The CM rated Hunt’s performance very highly, as highly as Price’s. They had both just ahead of Thurston.
Meninga thought Price would be MOM. Price produced 22 tackles, 14 hit-ups for a gain of 221m (that’s 15.8m per hitup - fantastic at this level), a charge-down that knocked the stuffing out of NSW and two tries (one ruled forward). Not bad for an old fella!
On my count, from 1980 to 2007 the teams have now played 78 games (including the LA game). NSW have scored 1260 points and Qld 1261.
Like I said earlier in the thread Steve Price is one of the great forwards of the last decade and very underated. He has such a steadying influence on a team. The Warriors looked like a rabble without him on Sunday.
Hayne should be dropped from SOO and suspended from the NRL for the blatant (soccer-style) dive he took in the second half. That’s not how the game is played; and his dismissal from the SOO arena, and suspension from the game should send the right message to current and future players alike.
Buderus is the most over-rated player on earth IMO. I’d replace him with Farrah.
Michael Monaghan for Mullen, Grothe Jnr for Hayne, O’Meley for Kite plus the inclusion of Gallen and Bird in the side somewhere.
Tongue for Steve Simpson also.
Spot on Alex. The Blues are no chance without a half to match Thurston. Monners would fit the bill, even though he has been given a bad time at the Sea Eagles, and he is superior to the Ox for the position. Alternatively, Kimmorley. I think Kimmorley will get the nod for the second game. For Queensland, Berrigan did nothing and he will be gone. I was also rather shocked at the exclusion of Matt Bowen. Compare Bell and Bowen, so what gives?
I’ve followed RL for 35 years (now a staunch Sth Sydney fan).
But the Origin of Species hoopla leaves me cold.
The big football game on Wednesday eve was in Athens. Alas, despite Liverpool dominating the first half, Berlusconi’s Bastard Boys got the prize.
Ken, I didn’t think Berrigan was all that bad. The word seems to be that the only change will be Carl Webb for Kafusi whose injury is truly horrific (tendon torn from the bone was what I heard).
Ken, the Queensland selectors said they love Bowen’s work, but they just can’t find a place for him. Warren Ryan and co on the ABC one day picked a whole Qld backline from current and former fullbacks (like Lockyer and Inglis). It was pretty classy. From memory they had Bowen at fullback and Hunt probably at half-back where he has played at least one game for the Broncos.
Bri,
You couldn’t move Thurston from half and it won’t happen. I am normally not a fan of Hunt, who exploded onto the scene a few years ago but then sort of stagnated. However, he had an exemplary game during SOI as fullback. I would leave him there.
At the very least, Bowen should be on the bench. I think Bowen could play wing or in the centres either as a replacement. Bowen is the only player than can think as fast as Thurston, be on his wavelength as a receiver of a killer ball. Most of the so-called “mistakes” were because the ball receiver was not up to Thurston’s speed of delivery.
On form (and let’s leave Berrigan out of this for a sec) Steven Bell should give way to Bowen. Hodges seems to have a problem with an injury because he was quietish. Hodges can’t be left out but, again, if he doesn’t click on the day, he should give way to Bowen from the bench midgame.
As to NSW, unless they can solve the half-5/8 combo, they are dead in the water. Anasta is a great individual player but he is not the general that either Lockyer or Thurston are.
I think we are seeing a wonderful partnership in the manner of Alfie and Wally all over again with Thurston and Lockyer. Wonderful to watch. As a New South Welshman, I am envious of the sheer magicianship that Queensland produces in rugby league.
Finally, as Thurston matures a bit, he will become among the greatest rugby league players ever - the pantheon where the King, Joey Johns, Reg Gasnier and Johnny raper and Clive Churchill are. I left out Mal Meninga because he didn’t have the all-round genius.
I can’t wait for State of Origin II.
Ken, Warren Ryan and David Morrow were just mucking around filling in the time. I reckon Thurston would be the first picked in the Qld team after Lockyer and along with Petro C.
Thurston has come a million miles since this time last year when he was deferring to Lockyer too much and was often just predictably handing the ball on. The Qld team is much better with Thurston playing his own game.
Hodges has got a gammy knee that needs an operation. He’s nursing it through the season and has been quietish in recent matches.
I think there is a preference for taller guys these days in the outside backs which may go against Bowen, and Slater for that matter.
Personally I can’t comment much on Bell except that Ryan has had wraps on him for years and they praised his defence last night.
I think Berrigan gets picked because he is a superfit athlete and has played in a lot of positions. At the end of last year he was first choice hooker for Australia.
Bowen ended Kimmorley’s rep career when he scored by intercepting a Kimmorley pass in extra time (SOO1 in 2005?). Ironically I’m not sure that Bowen has played since then either. I’m not saying he shouldn’t be there. I’ve just been trying to give you reasons why he isn’t.
Ken, as I was throwing out Wednesday’s Courier Mail I noticed an article on the Bell selection ahead of bigger stars. Essentially it said two things.
First, the selectors were happy with the job he did last year in attack and defence, had been watching his form carefully this year and were happy with what they saw.
Secondly with Meninga and Gene Miles involved in selection they ought to have a fair idea what it takes to be a good centre.
But obviously it’s not clear-cut and the unselected players have reason to feel unlucky.
These selections, it’s an imperfect science and one suspects there is always a complicated agenda. One thing worth keeping in mind is the fact that a selection into S o O raises the earning capacity of a player, or at least an ambit for a claim in the next contract negotiation with a club.
I note with interest that Bob Fulton is a selector for NSW.
A musing completely and utterly unconnected in any way whatsover with the above, I note that Monaghan has been given the opportunity to seek better conditions elsewhere, i.e. NOT at Manly Sea Eagles because he had the temerity to express the desire to remain playing halfback, basing his arrogant assumption on his form and the unarguable fact that he won the game through, note this, very accurate strategic kicks - as Warren Ryan clearly acknowledged on Grandstand telecast of the Manly Sea Eagles - Titans game recently.
“I can’t, for the life of me, understand why they (Manly Club) want to get rid of him,” Ryan told his audience.
The following day, in the Manly Daily, Peter Peters, who is a public relations flack for the club, attacked Ryan in print for this apostasy in his column “Zorba’s View”.
The internal issue is, apparently, that the major sponsor of the Eagles, northern beaches real estate tzar Max Delmege, expressed support for Monaghan. The club on the other hand, doesn’t rate him highly and doesn’t want to be seen to be wagged by the tail that is the major sponsor (bad precedent). Importantly, it doesn’t want to be seen as having made a dud decision in buying Orford.
But Monaghan has developed to be a far superior player to Orford, especially as a tactitian and on-field general.
As a consequence, the club would just like Monaghan to go away and Monners has obliged them by going to Warrington (UK) after the season ends here.
Obviously, picking Monaghan as NSW’s S o O half would not be on. Did I say who is on the NSW Origin selector panel?
Figures!