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	<title>Comments on: One whole day in committee</title>
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	<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/</link>
	<description>Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas</description>
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		<title>By: paul walter</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82027</link>
		<dc:creator>paul walter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Aug 2007 15:47:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82027</guid>
		<description>Good one, Tig Tog.
Nothing they love better than beggaring up a thread.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good one, Tig Tog.<br />
Nothing they love better than beggaring up a thread.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82026</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 05:29:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82026</guid>
		<description>It is going to be neither, and JG frankly I think the answer to your question is damned obvious. The whole point is to provide *extra* help to Indigenous people because we screwed them over and they are still suffering from it. Indeed, there still is an incredible amount of public discrimination towards the Indigenous.

The whole point is that we are trying to *raise* their status to equals. In the mean time, we still need to give them full rights, like any other citizen - 1) because this is just, and 2) because they will never attain full equality and full ability to participate in society if they are dictated to like children. This is straight from the liberalism of John Stuart Mill.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is going to be neither, and JG frankly I think the answer to your question is damned obvious. The whole point is to provide *extra* help to Indigenous people because we screwed them over and they are still suffering from it. Indeed, there still is an incredible amount of public discrimination towards the Indigenous.</p>
<p>The whole point is that we are trying to *raise* their status to equals. In the mean time, we still need to give them full rights, like any other citizen &#8211; 1) because this is just, and 2) because they will never attain full equality and full ability to participate in society if they are dictated to like children. This is straight from the liberalism of John Stuart Mill.</p>
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		<title>By: John Greenfield</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82025</link>
		<dc:creator>John Greenfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 03:34:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82025</guid>
		<description>tigtog

And herein lies the conflict innate to the way luvvies think about indigenous issues. On the one hand, you move hell and high water to divide Australia into indigenous and non-indigenous, insist on policies and funding that apply only to aborigines. Yet here when policies and funding ARE directed exclusively at certain unique remote communities, you insist that all Australians must be treated the same.

Which is it going to be?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tigtog</p>
<p>And herein lies the conflict innate to the way luvvies think about indigenous issues. On the one hand, you move hell and high water to divide Australia into indigenous and non-indigenous, insist on policies and funding that apply only to aborigines. Yet here when policies and funding ARE directed exclusively at certain unique remote communities, you insist that all Australians must be treated the same.</p>
<p>Which is it going to be?</p>
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		<title>By: tigtog</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82024</link>
		<dc:creator>tigtog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 03:28:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82024</guid>
		<description>Chav, can we move away from making this thread all about John Greenfield? Reacting to vexatious contrarianism derails the thread. Don&#039;t feed the contrarian unless he feeds you something that&#039;s actually substantive first, folks.

Now,&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/blanket-laws-for-sinners-and-saints/2007/08/10/1186530622346.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; from today&#039;s &lt;em&gt;Age&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;:
&lt;blockquote&gt;Indigenous Affairs Minister Mal Brough told ABC Radio that if the Government was breaching the Discrimination Act then it was &quot;in the interests of saving children … and I make no excuse for it&quot;.

But delegates from the Central Land Council say they are no less interested in protecting children. They back pornography and alcohol bans and quarantining welfare payments to bad parents — just not to all people.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I wish I could find who said it, but it&#039;s worth repeating anyway: students are given longer to write an essay than the Senate has been given to read this 500 page bill and evaluate it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chav, can we move away from making this thread all about John Greenfield? Reacting to vexatious contrarianism derails the thread. Don&#8217;t feed the contrarian unless he feeds you something that&#8217;s actually substantive first, folks.</p>
<p>Now,<a href="http://www.theage.com.au/news/national/blanket-laws-for-sinners-and-saints/2007/08/10/1186530622346.html" rel="nofollow"> from today&#8217;s <em>Age</em></a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>Indigenous Affairs Minister Mal Brough told ABC Radio that if the Government was breaching the Discrimination Act then it was &#8220;in the interests of saving children … and I make no excuse for it&#8221;.</p>
<p>But delegates from the Central Land Council say they are no less interested in protecting children. They back pornography and alcohol bans and quarantining welfare payments to bad parents — just not to all people.</p></blockquote>
<p>I wish I could find who said it, but it&#8217;s worth repeating anyway: students are given longer to write an essay than the Senate has been given to read this 500 page bill and evaluate it.</p>
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		<title>By: Chav</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82023</link>
		<dc:creator>Chav</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Aug 2007 00:09:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82023</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Wow, how original! A leftist &lt;em&gt;feminazi &lt;/em&gt;stamps her jackboot&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Wow, indeed!  Greenfield is both sexist and hates the poor, as he delightfully informed us over at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.leftwrites.net/2007/08/08/whatever-happened-to-green-valley/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;LeftWrites &lt;/a&gt;about his opinion on public housing, which he described as &#039;fetid social sewers&#039;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Wow, how original! A leftist <em>feminazi </em>stamps her jackboot</p></blockquote>
<p>Wow, indeed!  Greenfield is both sexist and hates the poor, as he delightfully informed us over at <a href="http://www.leftwrites.net/2007/08/08/whatever-happened-to-green-valley/" rel="nofollow">LeftWrites </a>about his opinion on public housing, which he described as &#8216;fetid social sewers&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: Graham Bell</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82022</link>
		<dc:creator>Graham Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2007 21:04:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82022</guid>
		<description>Bernice:
Have nothing concrete on any specific plans to delay or suspend the next federal election - just trends, track-record and an all-too-familiar pattern emerging.

Nor do I have any specific evidence of actual electoral fraud having being committed or being plotted right now - again, just trends, track-record and an all-too-familiar pattern emerging; although the disenfranchisement of the &quot;undeserving&quot; is cause for serious concern.    Whilst I have respect for the dedication and the probity of the Aust. Electoral Commission staff themselves, there are still opportunities for electoral fraud .... and so long as the Liberal, Labor and Nationals have a christmas-grip on the process, don&#039;t expect any beneficial electoral reform any time soon.

I will be only too happy to admit I was wrong if we do indeed have a completely free and fair federal election .... and in good time too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bernice:<br />
Have nothing concrete on any specific plans to delay or suspend the next federal election &#8211; just trends, track-record and an all-too-familiar pattern emerging.</p>
<p>Nor do I have any specific evidence of actual electoral fraud having being committed or being plotted right now &#8211; again, just trends, track-record and an all-too-familiar pattern emerging; although the disenfranchisement of the &#8220;undeserving&#8221; is cause for serious concern.    Whilst I have respect for the dedication and the probity of the Aust. Electoral Commission staff themselves, there are still opportunities for electoral fraud &#8230;. and so long as the Liberal, Labor and Nationals have a christmas-grip on the process, don&#8217;t expect any beneficial electoral reform any time soon.</p>
<p>I will be only too happy to admit I was wrong if we do indeed have a completely free and fair federal election &#8230;. and in good time too.</p>
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		<title>By: John Greenfield</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82021</link>
		<dc:creator>John Greenfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2007 11:47:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82021</guid>
		<description>tigtog

Well blow me down with a feather, you actually stepped up to defend me!!! :) While I am bullet-proof when it comes to cheap insults like that, I can tell that YOU are serious about folks cheapening the &quot;racist&quot; label. Clearly you fully realise that racism is a very real and ugly phenomenon that even in 2007 still hurts millions of people. It would help if rather than framing your bossy-finger as a &quot;don&#039;t feed the troll Greenfield&quot; opportunity, you actually slapped &#039;silkworm&#039; properly about these realities.

Even if you don&#039;t, props for at least doing something. Have a lovely night, sweetie. ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>tigtog</p>
<p>Well blow me down with a feather, you actually stepped up to defend me!!! <img src='http://larvatusprodeo.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  While I am bullet-proof when it comes to cheap insults like that, I can tell that YOU are serious about folks cheapening the &#8220;racist&#8221; label. Clearly you fully realise that racism is a very real and ugly phenomenon that even in 2007 still hurts millions of people. It would help if rather than framing your bossy-finger as a &#8220;don&#8217;t feed the troll Greenfield&#8221; opportunity, you actually slapped &#8216;silkworm&#8217; properly about these realities.</p>
<p>Even if you don&#8217;t, props for at least doing something. Have a lovely night, sweetie. <img src='http://larvatusprodeo.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Bernice</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82020</link>
		<dc:creator>Bernice</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2007 08:46:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82020</guid>
		<description>Very curious Graham as to whether you imagine it all too possible, or have come across something, well, concrete? You could argue that electoral fraud has been already committed by legislative changes to the closing of the polls, &amp; the disenfranchiseement of those incarcerated. Can&#039;t quite see how they could hang their chads, but preference deals in the Senate are a potential I suppose? Clandestine funding of Family First? Sounds like a job for the Embittered Brethren...

&amp; for god&#039;s sake EVERY ONE - make sure your electoral details are up to date - otherwise kiss that vote goodbye.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very curious Graham as to whether you imagine it all too possible, or have come across something, well, concrete? You could argue that electoral fraud has been already committed by legislative changes to the closing of the polls, &amp; the disenfranchiseement of those incarcerated. Can&#8217;t quite see how they could hang their chads, but preference deals in the Senate are a potential I suppose? Clandestine funding of Family First? Sounds like a job for the Embittered Brethren&#8230;</p>
<p>&amp; for god&#8217;s sake EVERY ONE &#8211; make sure your electoral details are up to date &#8211; otherwise kiss that vote goodbye.</p>
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		<title>By: Graham Bell</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82019</link>
		<dc:creator>Graham Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2007 08:27:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82019</guid>
		<description>Tigtog:
It was wonderful news that some Senators had their own unofficial &quot;hearing&quot; [short though it was] with a couple of people well-informed, rather than well-coached, on what was happening to our Aboriginal fellow citizens.

Three mighty cheers!!!!.

Tim [at 12:57pm]:
At least you do indeed understand incremental evil.   Unfortunately, a lot of people do not ....yet.   Your grandfather would have told you all about what happened &lt;strong&gt;AFTER 1933 &lt;/strong&gt; and how almost everybody still hung onto the irrational hope that things would get better sooner or later ....

If not a delayed or suspended federal election then almost certainly a rigged one.   These people have shown time and again their ruthlessness, their lack of honour and their abandonment of fair-dinkum Australian values.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tigtog:<br />
It was wonderful news that some Senators had their own unofficial &#8220;hearing&#8221; [short though it was] with a couple of people well-informed, rather than well-coached, on what was happening to our Aboriginal fellow citizens.</p>
<p>Three mighty cheers!!!!.</p>
<p>Tim [at 12:57pm]:<br />
At least you do indeed understand incremental evil.   Unfortunately, a lot of people do not &#8230;.yet.   Your grandfather would have told you all about what happened <strong>AFTER 1933 </strong> and how almost everybody still hung onto the irrational hope that things would get better sooner or later &#8230;.</p>
<p>If not a delayed or suspended federal election then almost certainly a rigged one.   These people have shown time and again their ruthlessness, their lack of honour and their abandonment of fair-dinkum Australian values.</p>
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		<title>By: Bernice</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82018</link>
		<dc:creator>Bernice</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Aug 2007 08:09:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/08/10/one-whole-day-in-committee/#comment-82018</guid>
		<description>Regardless of the election, whenever it occurs, the coalition will still hold the balance of power for six months after the election? &amp; if mining interests are smart enough to use the laundry window of opportunity to get in &amp; peg mining leases, the legislative privilege that such claims enjoy both federally &amp; state-based, will make it extremely hard to wind this back without lengthy legal squabbles &amp; the strong likelyhood of compensation - remember that nice tree trade agreement we signed with the US? oh I can see NAFTA all over again...

This legislation has to be stopped - is there a senator on the government side with a smiggen of humanity? We&#039;re about to find out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regardless of the election, whenever it occurs, the coalition will still hold the balance of power for six months after the election? &amp; if mining interests are smart enough to use the laundry window of opportunity to get in &amp; peg mining leases, the legislative privilege that such claims enjoy both federally &amp; state-based, will make it extremely hard to wind this back without lengthy legal squabbles &amp; the strong likelyhood of compensation &#8211; remember that nice tree trade agreement we signed with the US? oh I can see NAFTA all over again&#8230;</p>
<p>This legislation has to be stopped &#8211; is there a senator on the government side with a smiggen of humanity? We&#8217;re about to find out.</p>
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