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	<title>Comments on: Media poll owners don&#039;t believe polls, media reveals!</title>
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	<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/</link>
	<description>Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 10:53:13 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Darryl Mason</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75921</link>
		<dc:creator>Darryl Mason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 15:01:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75921</guid>
		<description>Shanahan&#039;s writings have become the newspaper equivalent of magic mushrooms.

You start in, you feel a bit like having a little puke, then it settles down, then everything gets really, really trippy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shanahan&#8217;s writings have become the newspaper equivalent of magic mushrooms.</p>
<p>You start in, you feel a bit like having a little puke, then it settles down, then everything gets really, really trippy.</p>
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		<title>By: Ambigulous</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75920</link>
		<dc:creator>Ambigulous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 03:52:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75920</guid>
		<description>Thanks Jon,

so it&#039;s against their journalistic interests to give a fair and balanced presentation of the &#039;results&#039; of the a poll.

&quot;Hmmmmmm, why is it so?&quot; (with apologies to Julius Sumner-Miller)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Jon,</p>
<p>so it&#8217;s against their journalistic interests to give a fair and balanced presentation of the &#8216;results&#8217; of the a poll.</p>
<p>&#8220;Hmmmmmm, why is it so?&#8221; (with apologies to Julius Sumner-Miller)</p>
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		<title>By: Jon</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75919</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 12:23:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75919</guid>
		<description>Hi Ambiguous.
Yes I have Market Research and statistics training. It makes for a more accurate representation of the data to display the error bars +/-3% or so in the charts, but it would restrict the &quot;analysis&quot; and big-grab, absolutist headlines by the traditional media who are happy to portray the data as dead-on accurate when it suits them; especially when there&#039;s a slight &quot;swing&quot; in the Government&#039;s favour.

Whilst it might confuse the general pubic for a time, it would also educate them on what the error margin actually means in relation to the poll results. But maybe they see that as a bad thing, as it might further erode their headline power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Ambiguous.<br />
Yes I have Market Research and statistics training. It makes for a more accurate representation of the data to display the error bars +/-3% or so in the charts, but it would restrict the &#8220;analysis&#8221; and big-grab, absolutist headlines by the traditional media who are happy to portray the data as dead-on accurate when it suits them; especially when there&#8217;s a slight &#8220;swing&#8221; in the Government&#8217;s favour.</p>
<p>Whilst it might confuse the general pubic for a time, it would also educate them on what the error margin actually means in relation to the poll results. But maybe they see that as a bad thing, as it might further erode their headline power.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75918</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 12:18:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75918</guid>
		<description>Ambigulous, &quot;pundit&quot; is indeed derived from the Hindi - it passed into the language in the 18th century, and its meaning has changed since then.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ambigulous, &#8220;pundit&#8221; is indeed derived from the Hindi &#8211; it passed into the language in the 18th century, and its meaning has changed since then.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75917</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 12:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75917</guid>
		<description>Economan, I think the Jackman research in question was about the sample being skewed affecting the primaries, not how the 2PP is calculated. But as well as possible structural sampling error, Newspoll&#039;s basic problem is that it doesn&#039;t give enough options when asking who you would vote for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Economan, I think the Jackman research in question was about the sample being skewed affecting the primaries, not how the 2PP is calculated. But as well as possible structural sampling error, Newspoll&#8217;s basic problem is that it doesn&#8217;t give enough options when asking who you would vote for.</p>
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		<title>By: Ambigulous</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75916</link>
		<dc:creator>Ambigulous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 11:27:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75916</guid>
		<description>Jon: on margins of error in sampling -

it&#039;s often stated in the fine print when a poll is published, but very rarely DISCUSSED in the accompanying news or opinion pieces. Which is a shame. Are the writers innumerate? I would have thought &quot;one divided by the square root of the sample size&quot; is not too difficult to explain in a paragraph or too. But then pages of sheer, dreary, tremulous speculation would be exposed for the nonsense they are.

Statistics rules! (plus or minus 3%)

Can anyone explain the association between the term &quot;pundit&quot; as used in Australia, and the honourific &quot;Pandit&quot;? I thought the latter was confined to very WISE men such as Jawaharlal Nehru, who had to do the hard yards in the early days of independence?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jon: on margins of error in sampling -</p>
<p>it&#8217;s often stated in the fine print when a poll is published, but very rarely DISCUSSED in the accompanying news or opinion pieces. Which is a shame. Are the writers innumerate? I would have thought &#8220;one divided by the square root of the sample size&#8221; is not too difficult to explain in a paragraph or too. But then pages of sheer, dreary, tremulous speculation would be exposed for the nonsense they are.</p>
<p>Statistics rules! (plus or minus 3%)</p>
<p>Can anyone explain the association between the term &#8220;pundit&#8221; as used in Australia, and the honourific &#8220;Pandit&#8221;? I thought the latter was confined to very WISE men such as Jawaharlal Nehru, who had to do the hard yards in the early days of independence?</p>
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		<title>By: Mick Strummer</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75915</link>
		<dc:creator>Mick Strummer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 10:46:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75915</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Well if the polls are on the money and Labor wins in a landslide, what are all these pundits going to do?&lt;/blockquote&gt;
What will they do? Exactly what they do now. Suck up to those in power and their minders and write the same old stuff as usual. Dennis Shanahan will not - although he should - lose his job and be turfed out onto the streets, forced to eke out a meagre living selling cigarettes rolled out of tobacco gathered from butts left lying on the pavement. Glenn Milne will continue to take inappropriate mixtures of alcohol, anti-depressents, pain killers and stimulants. Peter Hartcher will go on pretending to be unbiased. Good old Matt Price will probably get a job in PM&amp;C, even though his heart is small-L Liberal because he has been gamely predicting a Labor win for months.
And they will write lots of in-depth articles about how &quot;serious thoughtful insightful journalism&quot; is going to the dogs.
That is my prediction, anyway.
Cheers...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Well if the polls are on the money and Labor wins in a landslide, what are all these pundits going to do?</p></blockquote>
<p>What will they do? Exactly what they do now. Suck up to those in power and their minders and write the same old stuff as usual. Dennis Shanahan will not &#8211; although he should &#8211; lose his job and be turfed out onto the streets, forced to eke out a meagre living selling cigarettes rolled out of tobacco gathered from butts left lying on the pavement. Glenn Milne will continue to take inappropriate mixtures of alcohol, anti-depressents, pain killers and stimulants. Peter Hartcher will go on pretending to be unbiased. Good old Matt Price will probably get a job in PM&amp;C, even though his heart is small-L Liberal because he has been gamely predicting a Labor win for months.<br />
And they will write lots of in-depth articles about how &#8220;serious thoughtful insightful journalism&#8221; is going to the dogs.<br />
That is my prediction, anyway.<br />
Cheers&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Hal9000</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75914</link>
		<dc:creator>Hal9000</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 10:23:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75914</guid>
		<description>I disagree, Danny.  John Howard has only ever had one vision for Australia - a country with himself as Prime Minister.  He&#039;s only in it for the constant ego-stroking and without that, he&#039;s got nothing to live for.  Since he and Janette have turned snubbing and humiliation of their predecessors into a vindictive little art form, they&#039;ll know what they&#039;re in for.  Don&#039;t imagine either that JWH will get the Clinton, GHW Bush or Tony Blair big bucks on the international lecture circuit - he&#039;s a nonentity&#039;s nonentity with a charisma-ectomy.

In a few months he&#039;ll be telling people serving him in shops and restaurants that he used to be Prime Minister of Australia and they&#039;ll play along with the crazy old man to humour him - just like Frank Forde use to do.  I confidently predict Howard&#039;s rapid physical and psychological decline into a pathetic right-wing Sandy Stone.  For survivors of the Howard immigration gulag, there may be some justice in this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I disagree, Danny.  John Howard has only ever had one vision for Australia &#8211; a country with himself as Prime Minister.  He&#8217;s only in it for the constant ego-stroking and without that, he&#8217;s got nothing to live for.  Since he and Janette have turned snubbing and humiliation of their predecessors into a vindictive little art form, they&#8217;ll know what they&#8217;re in for.  Don&#8217;t imagine either that JWH will get the Clinton, GHW Bush or Tony Blair big bucks on the international lecture circuit &#8211; he&#8217;s a nonentity&#8217;s nonentity with a charisma-ectomy.</p>
<p>In a few months he&#8217;ll be telling people serving him in shops and restaurants that he used to be Prime Minister of Australia and they&#8217;ll play along with the crazy old man to humour him &#8211; just like Frank Forde use to do.  I confidently predict Howard&#8217;s rapid physical and psychological decline into a pathetic right-wing Sandy Stone.  For survivors of the Howard immigration gulag, there may be some justice in this.</p>
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		<title>By: Danny</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75913</link>
		<dc:creator>Danny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 09:26:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75913</guid>
		<description>Phil, 10:04- &quot;Howard is never leaving.. politics is all he’s got&quot;...

Not so, he and janette are grandparents now, they just may want to enjoy their senior years as such.
He doesn&#039;t want to be anywhere near the seat of power, and therefore responsibility, when the flock of nasty economic, and other, werechickens  come home to roost.
It&#039;s like in mid &#039;86, when &quot;Australia was on its way to becoming a &quot;banana republic&quot;, the Australian currency had recently suffered a 40 per cent devaluation, the country had lost its Triple AAA credit rating and the current account deficit was reaching for the sky&quot;, and JWH himself said &quot; The times will suit me&quot;.....to not be in the driving seat, then as now.

He knows very well his has been one long lucky streak, (though PK will protest luck&#039;s got nothing to do with it, at least on the economic front), and time&#039;s up. He&#039;s done his job on the party, kept Costello from having a turn, set it up so Malcolm can have his, after sitting  this one out.
George and John and Janette will be be sorting out a suitable retirement post for him, say in Carlyle group... if it&#039;s good enough for John Major...
Nucular power is looking good, Ron W&#039;s already done the groundwork.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil, 10:04- &#8220;Howard is never leaving.. politics is all he’s got&#8221;&#8230;</p>
<p>Not so, he and janette are grandparents now, they just may want to enjoy their senior years as such.<br />
He doesn&#8217;t want to be anywhere near the seat of power, and therefore responsibility, when the flock of nasty economic, and other, werechickens  come home to roost.<br />
It&#8217;s like in mid &#8217;86, when &#8220;Australia was on its way to becoming a &#8220;banana republic&#8221;, the Australian currency had recently suffered a 40 per cent devaluation, the country had lost its Triple AAA credit rating and the current account deficit was reaching for the sky&#8221;, and JWH himself said &#8221; The times will suit me&#8221;&#8230;..to not be in the driving seat, then as now.</p>
<p>He knows very well his has been one long lucky streak, (though PK will protest luck&#8217;s got nothing to do with it, at least on the economic front), and time&#8217;s up. He&#8217;s done his job on the party, kept Costello from having a turn, set it up so Malcolm can have his, after sitting  this one out.<br />
George and John and Janette will be be sorting out a suitable retirement post for him, say in Carlyle group&#8230; if it&#8217;s good enough for John Major&#8230;<br />
Nucular power is looking good, Ron W&#8217;s already done the groundwork.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75912</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Sep 2007 09:23:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2007/09/05/media-poll-owners-dont-believe-polls-media-reveals/#comment-75912</guid>
		<description>Well... The whole goal of the Whitlam campaign was to emphasise the break with the past. But Rudd is doing his best to minimise difference and portray the image of &#039;business as usual&#039; but without AWAs with a younger face. It&#039;s not associated with a major cultural shift like Whitlam.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well&#8230; The whole goal of the Whitlam campaign was to emphasise the break with the past. But Rudd is doing his best to minimise difference and portray the image of &#8216;business as usual&#8217; but without AWAs with a younger face. It&#8217;s not associated with a major cultural shift like Whitlam.</p>
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