Ooo i’ve been moderated.

Poor kid, does it hurt? Never mind, it will grow back again

I know spiked’s ‘philosophy’ is close to your libertarian heart, Jason, and it pains you to see them criticised.

I believe Jason was asking you to criticize them rather than just berate them.

and their refusal to admit same and take on board the considerable solid evidence against their line, was even worse.

Yes it’s a little disconcerting. It’s called the Internet.

They treated both their legitimate critics and the real evidence with contempt and ridicule, all the while posing as the hard-nosed science based side of the debate. The stench of hypocrisy was overwhelming.

Likewise disconcerting. It’s called politics.

They are nothing more than arrogant, illegitimate control freaks, bourgeois fuckwits, who get off on lecturing the rest of us on how stupid and selfish we all are, and how we should view the world and live our lives.

And that’s called blogging.
>
Now that we’re done with the tutorial you might want to tell us what you really think about the good folks at spiked.com?

I haven’t read Hamilton and sometimes he seems a bit puritanical for me.

We could’ve stopped wrapped this thread much earlier if only you’d've enlightened us a bit earlier, Fine.

THe ABC story quoting Mr harvey:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/02/05/2154923.htm

http://canberra.yourguide.com.au/news/opinion/opinion/as-personal-debt-rises-prosperity-blurs-in-illusion/1177639.html

http://business.smh.com.au/oldfashioned-thrift-is-suddenly-cool/20080208-1r4b.html

Nabs - will post them soon .

“And yet you seem to have such a rapport with these immense and deadly carnivores. How do you build that mutual trust between man and animal, how do you bond with them? What is your secret?”

“I feed them.”

Now ask me about the ultimate basic secret of happiness in societies.

A cat that can’t live off your leftover lamb chops, spag bol and pizza is basically even more of a freeloader than the little bastards are generally genetically programmed to be. And my idea of bling for felines is seeing how far you can insert a twistie into their ear before they wake up. I do like ‘em but I have no illusions about would happen if the relationship was reversed.

By the by, SubCowGirl, when are you going to poligoth Sarko and Bruni? - the whackiest power couple the world’s seen for a long time.

Just dont get me started on the relative merit of the pet food/accessory industry vs basic social justice in society or i will truly go off the deep end
I swear there should be alaw against animal bling.

‘ I really dont think Hamilton or james etc would disagree as these are issues that have a huge overlap with social wellbeing.’

I worded this badly, i meant to say they would agree its not as big a prob, but, financial stress is still a factor that has implications on social wellbeing.

(I do know just a little about helping people leaving abusive relationships and obtain public housing btw…)

Le Chat - Guillaume Apollinaire

Must you lick him or can you bite bits off him too??

Well a chocolate orang must have a chocolate burung….;)

orang utang - man of the forest?

orang - man?

so “Terry’s chocolate orang” is a man made of chocolate who belongs to Terry?? Can you buy such a man? Is he hygeinic? Must you lick him or can you bite bits off him too??

I think we should be told. Confess, Fine !!! You saucy perempuan….

I know spiked’s ‘philosophy’ is close to your libertarian heart, Jason, and it pains you to see them criticised.

But I have had dealings with them before over some medical science stuff, about which I know a shitload. Their technical ignorance and incompetence was appalling, and their refusal to admit same and take on board the considerable solid evidence against their line, was even worse. They treated both their legitimate critics and the real evidence with contempt and ridicule, all the while posing as the hard-nosed science based side of the debate. The stench of hypocrisy was overwhelming.

So after that experience, I went and read through a fair chunk of their output, and that of their critics, and had a look at their general history. Not impressed.

They are nothing more than arrogant, illegitimate control freaks, bourgeois fuckwits, who get off on lecturing the rest of us on how stupid and selfish we all are, and how we should view the world and live our lives. Just like they have always done, inlcuding when they were so certain about their ‘revolutionary’ Trotskyite view of the world, which they now disown.

Their primary motivation is the smell of power. They want to profoundly influence public policy, but without having to take the responsibility for it. So they are building up this well-connected, and increasingly influential network behind the scenes in the UK, but without any real accountability. If you are worried about unjustified state intrusion into people’s lives, they are some of the first I would be looking at, their libertarian facade notwithstanding.

They are not genuine libertarians trying to enlighten and free us poor plebs, and they deserve no respect at all, IMHO.

Sorry if you find that offensive, but I (and many other decent, intelligent, and informed people) find them and their approach completely objectionable and very worrying.

I really dont think Hamilton or james etc would disagree as these are issues that have a huge overlap with social wellbeing.

Its worth unpacking the issues you raised a little more.

Why is there a shortage of public housing? Because there are many many people who cannot access or adequetely afford the private rental market. THere are a multiplicity of reasons for this but they include:

a) rent being too high - (usually due to either investors seeking to cover repayment costs in an environment of rising inflation/rates or charging higher rent s opportunistically, without associated wage equity).

or b) they have been blacklisted on the TICA list for rental defaults or damage.

The reasons why people default are broad, but playing into the equation is high debt, with low serviceability. A large number of people wait out the three year interest free period and are then ‘hit’ with very high interest repayments sometimes leading to defaults, which lead to a bad credit ratings, which leads to low doc borrowing, which in turn leads to very high interest repayments which blows the rent budget, pisses off the landlord and gets them blacklisted from all other properties ….you get the picture.

Quite often in this stressful scenario of making ends meet substance abuse and violence becomes a more prevalent, compounding the issues. Man drinks, get angry, domestically violent, punches hole in wall and pisses off. Wife and kids take off to a refuge, scared to be home when dad comes back. Social workers and financial counsellors ward off debt collectors (who may have opportunistically bought the right to the debt from our kindly 3 year interest free friends…) and begin the fraught task of securing a new home for a family with no income, and no chance in the private rental market.

Just sayin.

Terry’s chocolate orang! Yum. Years since I’ve had one of those.

A chocolate orang? The lickable sort?….

Just be careful asking for one of those in Indonesia or Malaysia…

Without an environmental crisis it wouldn’t be the government’s job to worry about these things. But in a situation where we have multiple environmental crises and people sitting around saying The Australian/American way of life is not negotiable because its so important for our happiness Hamilton’s point is valuable (although it would be better if it wasn’t being espoused by someone who seems so keen to avoid pleasures that aren’t environmentally destructive as well).

This is where its relevant to consider the source you’ve linked to. Spiked are deliberately propagating lies which will kill millions and make the lives of billions hellish. They know it and they don’t care as long as they get their plasma TVs and 4WDs. That doesn’t mean they’re always wrong, but its a pretty poisoned tree from which their fruit comes.