Comments on: Rewriting Zimbabwean history

By: Ambigulous

Ambigulous — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 20:53:39 +0000

Stone’s Green Ginger, cheap sherry, cheap port, beer. If you remember anything from the 60’s [hah!!] it may be those lovely curved glass “flagons” that bulk wine was sold in, before le Chateua Cardboard. I recall a barrel shaped one with ribs, and a closer-to-cylindrical one. Quite heavy. This was when milk was sold in (recyclable) bottles too.
Queen Victoria on the Throne, bless her. No talk of Federation. Goldfields abuzz. I did mean the EIGHTEEN sixties.

By: Paul Burns

Paul Burns — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 11:02:28 +0000

SATP,
Uni students should probably be between trade unionists and bikies.

By: steve at the pub

steve at the pub — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 06:23:18 +0000

#43: I heard that!

Never had to deal with a student demographic. Presumably they are a tamer, more articulate, less cashed up version of the young knuckleheads I currently have the mixed blessing of catering to.

No matter what uni students are like, they could not possibly be as odious as Corporates (my least favourite demographic)

In order of preference (In my ignorance I’d slot uni students in at about #9):
1/ Builders & building trades workers (chippies, labourers, plumbers, painters etc)
2/ Motor trades (mecanics, panel beaters etc)
3/ Assorted other trades
4/ Trade Unionists
5/ Motor cycle gangs
6/ Barristers & entourage
7/ Fishermen, truckies, stockmen & bush workers
8/ “grey people” 25-45yo
9/ dole-eys
10+/ Everybody else
>100/ corporate clients

By: Paul Burns

Paul Burns — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 05:12:40 +0000

I got onto Green Ginger Wine before I went to uni. And Blackberry Nip.

By: Mark

Mark — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:51:54 +0000

Couldn’t afford enough, DD.

Satp and others in the liquor trade should be wary of too much University bashing. Students are some of their biggest and most enthusiastic customers.

By: The Devil Drink

The Devil Drink — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:50:32 +0000

The memories!

Someone obviously wasn’t trying.

By: Mark

Mark — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:48:39 +0000

Ah tallies of VB. The essential student survival ambrosia. In winter mixed with Stones Green Ginger wine. The memories!

By: Klaus K

Klaus K — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:32:27 +0000

“Klaus, does holding a Bachelor’s, Master’s or PhD from a Uni preclude one from enrolling in those excellent courses you’re spruiking?”

No, it doesn’t preclude you, but you’re not entitled to HECS, RTS or any other support, and you’re going to have to pay up front every fortnight to the landlord, to the bank, and so on, with just enough left for a couple of longnecks of VB if you’re lucky.

By: BilB

BilB — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:00:46 +0000

My mistake. That should have been Howard the “whipper boy” not “whipping boy”. Wrong end of the cane.

By: BilB

BilB — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 01:19:09 +0000

I’d prefer to whip Howard with this mess, as he was the last Australian to use Zimbabwe as a political tool by going there as a Commonwealth whipping boy, then walking away and forgetting all about Mugabe. My warped read on that is that Howard liked what he saw in Mugabe. But in reality Africa is Africa’s problem and Europe’s responsibility. It was Europe that carved up Africa into these unworkable boundaries to suit their own territorial passions. It was Europe that raided the continent for everything that it had (Belgium and the Congo for instance). So Europeans have the moral responsibility to facilitate a modern Africa, but it is only Africans who can make this happen. Only Africans can decide how they want their country to work, even if they have to go back to a tribal route to get to it.

By: steve at the pub

steve at the pub — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 14:05:56 +0000

Presumably Klaus’ courses are marked by self-assessment? Glad to see everybody else has their Zimbabwe commentariat credentials up to date
Except David Rubie, whose bigoted view of NQ seems as if it comes from a leather armchaired London Gentelmen’s Club!

Anyway. As it has turned out, Mugabe was everything bad that Ian Smith was, only worse in every way, without the administrative & political competence which Smith had.

Mugabe has rooted one of the better-off countries in Africa.
Smith proved that he could turn Rhodesia into one of the better countries in Africa, while concurrenly fighting off a guerilla insurgency. Hideously racist though his administration was, it was miles better than the one which followed it.

By: Mark

Mark — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 12:07:57 +0000

Ambigulous, yes, the PRC funded his armed insurgency.

By: Paul Burns

Paul Burns — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 11:56:36 +0000

Klaus,
I graduated in all those courses (except the anti-intellectual one) before I went to uni.

By: Ambigulous

Ambigulous — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 11:44:32 +0000

Thanks Mark, I was hoping for a bit more detail. Was Mugabe ever seriously in the China camp, in that other Cold War rivalry: USSR vs PRC?

Klaus, does holding a Bachelor’s, Master’s or PhD from a Uni preclude one from enrolling in those excellent courses you’re spruiking?

By: Klaus K

Klaus K — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 05:39:53 +0000

Sure, some of us have the usual qualifications and have done a bit of reading but unless you have the relevant degree from the University of Life Experience (ULE), especially the double degree Bachelor of Common Sense/Bachelor of Human Nature (BCS/BHumN), or alternatively the School of Hard Knocks (which has one of the best graduate programs in Anti-Intellectual Studies around), then your ‘knowledge’ isn’t worth much at all.

By: Paul Burns

Paul Burns — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 03:45:11 +0000

Ambigulous,
Quite a few years ago now there was a rumour going round that Mugabe had syphilis and his unstable violent behaviour was attributed to syphilitic insanity. Its such a long time ago I can’t remember the source.
SATP,
I’ve been studying African colonial history for some time now because of my interest in the 18C slave trade.And anybody on LP who studied OZ history at uni, would have at least touched on the history of Sudan (first o/s deployment of NSW troops) and the history of South Africa (Boer War). When I was teaching we stopped at 1975, but I’ve no doubt the Fraser era is now studied in depth in Oz history courses at uni. This would include Fraser’s foreign policy which would have to include Zimbabwe.Its unwise to presume ignorance on current affairs on LP. As Mark and Amused have so ably demonstrated to you.

By: Andrew

Andrew — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 03:45:05 +0000

“but to use the awful situation the country finds itself in as a stick to beat up his political opponents with, speaks to how we should judge him.”

Is this Zimbabwe or Iraq you’re referring to?

By: feral sparrowhawk

feral sparrowhawk — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 03:37:43 +0000

I admit to a regrettable ignorance about Zimbabwean history, but I’m a bit more up on Australian psephology. I note that Colebatch’s impressive CV “author, poet, lecturer, journalist, editor, and lawyer” leaves out “unsuccessful Liberal candidate for a basically unloseable seat”.

Methinks he’s never got over it. Then again, this level of out-of-touchness with people’s basic concerns probably has something to do with it.

By: Paul Norton

Paul Norton — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 03:34:51 +0000

Geoff, if memory serves correctly, Nkomo and ZAPU were the pro-Soviet faction in Zimbabwe whilst Mugabe and ZANU-PF were pro-China. How does this sit with your interesting analysis and counterfactual?

By: Mark

Mark — Thu, 17 Apr 2008 03:29:28 +0000

Ambigulous, Fraser discusses the role of Mugabe’s first wife in his riposte to Colebatch:

http://blogs.theaustralian.news.com.au/yoursay/index.php/theaustralian/comments/why_i_backed_mugabe/