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	<title>Comments on: Rhetoric, reality, Rudd</title>
	<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/</link>
	<description>Blogging politics, culture, sociology and life from Brisvegas</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 00:36:59 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.3</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: rainne</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459358</link>
		<dc:creator>rainne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 07:50:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459358</guid>
		<description>They're definitely here and visible in SA (there's one in the Central train station Arcade, for example).  I've encountered them (tangentially; I'm a lawyer vaguely in the Labour Law area) where female workers want advice or follow through on discrimination claims, unfair dismissal claims, sexual harrassment claims, etc.  

I understand that they provide a first point of call for those women and can help them liaise with other organisations or navigate the Industrial Relations Tribunal and suchlike.  From looking at the office from outside, they also seem to provide things like computer access, information on various rights and resources.

I've never dealt with them personally, but I'm surprised to hear that no-one else has heard of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They&#8217;re definitely here and visible in SA (there&#8217;s one in the Central train station Arcade, for example).  I&#8217;ve encountered them (tangentially; I&#8217;m a lawyer vaguely in the Labour Law area) where female workers want advice or follow through on discrimination claims, unfair dismissal claims, sexual harrassment claims, etc.  </p>
<p>I understand that they provide a first point of call for those women and can help them liaise with other organisations or navigate the Industrial Relations Tribunal and suchlike.  From looking at the office from outside, they also seem to provide things like computer access, information on various rights and resources.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve never dealt with them personally, but I&#8217;m surprised to hear that no-one else has heard of them.</p>
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		<title>By: jane</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459105</link>
		<dc:creator>jane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:30:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459105</guid>
		<description>I live in SA and I've never heard of them, either. In fact, no-one I know, including my daughter and her circle of friends, has heard of them, so I doubt they'll be sorely missed. I live in rural SA and there certainly aren't any offices in this neck of the woods. My daughter and her scaly mates live in Adelaide where you'd be more likely to find them and they seem to be pretty thin on the ground there. What is/was their function? 
I reckon they're like a lot of government programmes which are studiously kept below the radar and then quietly axed.
In the meantime, to paraphrase Spiros @9, knee-jerk foaming at the mouth and red-faced outrage should be saved until we know what we're getting excited about.
I won't be emailing my waste-of-space MP Patrick Secker about it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I live in SA and I&#8217;ve never heard of them, either. In fact, no-one I know, including my daughter and her circle of friends, has heard of them, so I doubt they&#8217;ll be sorely missed. I live in rural SA and there certainly aren&#8217;t any offices in this neck of the woods. My daughter and her scaly mates live in Adelaide where you&#8217;d be more likely to find them and they seem to be pretty thin on the ground there. What is/was their function?<br />
I reckon they&#8217;re like a lot of government programmes which are studiously kept below the radar and then quietly axed.<br />
In the meantime, to paraphrase Spiros @9, knee-jerk foaming at the mouth and red-faced outrage should be saved until we know what we&#8217;re getting excited about.<br />
I won&#8217;t be emailing my waste-of-space MP Patrick Secker about it.</p>
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		<title>By: Nabakov</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459053</link>
		<dc:creator>Nabakov</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 11:25:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459053</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Well its all a bit hazy as pre-Budget Chinese whispers tend to be.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

You got it gorgeous.

These days, an Budget is the biggest and most accountable statement Australian Governments can make. So a Budget's media/vested interests/general public audiences are strategically spun and tatically managed well in advance through a cloud of leaks, rumours, hints of ambit claims honoured or ignored and unsurprisingly surprise advance announcements.

Remember, the one true test of a politically well balanced budget is if everyone is equally pissed off. The moment one pressure group starts with the unconditional praise, you know you've fucked up equally unconditionally elsewhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Well its all a bit hazy as pre-Budget Chinese whispers tend to be.</p></blockquote>
<p>You got it gorgeous.</p>
<p>These days, an Budget is the biggest and most accountable statement Australian Governments can make. So a Budget&#8217;s media/vested interests/general public audiences are strategically spun and tatically managed well in advance through a cloud of leaks, rumours, hints of ambit claims honoured or ignored and unsurprisingly surprise advance announcements.</p>
<p>Remember, the one true test of a politically well balanced budget is if everyone is equally pissed off. The moment one pressure group starts with the unconditional praise, you know you&#8217;ve fucked up equally unconditionally elsewhere.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459051</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 11:15:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459051</guid>
		<description>Yes, she did. She established the Women's Advice Centre in Queensland in the 1980s. And, yes, it still exists.

The reason why these centres don't exist nationwide is that they're community organisations not a government program.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, she did. She established the Women&#8217;s Advice Centre in Queensland in the 1980s. And, yes, it still exists.</p>
<p>The reason why these centres don&#8217;t exist nationwide is that they&#8217;re community organisations not a government program.</p>
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		<title>By: mckenzie</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459048</link>
		<dc:creator>mckenzie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 10:58:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-459048</guid>
		<description>Don't have them in Victoria either.

Why would the Federal government fund a service that isn't available to all states? surely the individual states should support them.

I would also suggest the reference to Quentin Bryce is a bit twee - did she get her start in Working Womens Centres or in something like them??

If the second, what was the something and does it still exist?

You can't justify keeping funding for something just because another similar program (which may still exist and not be under threat) was beneficial.

Similarly, just because Howard et al did not axe something does not mean it is therefore inherently bad for the ALP to do so...I'm a fiercely lefty type and there's lots of programs I would be happy to see the back of, despite them not being axed by Kennett or Howard.

If they're a waste of money then I'd rather the money went to programs that aren't.

All sounds a bit knee jerky to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t have them in Victoria either.</p>
<p>Why would the Federal government fund a service that isn&#8217;t available to all states? surely the individual states should support them.</p>
<p>I would also suggest the reference to Quentin Bryce is a bit twee - did she get her start in Working Womens Centres or in something like them??</p>
<p>If the second, what was the something and does it still exist?</p>
<p>You can&#8217;t justify keeping funding for something just because another similar program (which may still exist and not be under threat) was beneficial.</p>
<p>Similarly, just because Howard et al did not axe something does not mean it is therefore inherently bad for the ALP to do so&#8230;I&#8217;m a fiercely lefty type and there&#8217;s lots of programs I would be happy to see the back of, despite them not being axed by Kennett or Howard.</p>
<p>If they&#8217;re a waste of money then I&#8217;d rather the money went to programs that aren&#8217;t.</p>
<p>All sounds a bit knee jerky to me.</p>
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		<title>By: professor rat</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458969</link>
		<dc:creator>professor rat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 07:04:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458969</guid>
		<description>What a piece of work is Lindsay Tanner! 
A nosebleed elitist. A sexist swine. A reactionary piece-of-shit from way back. 
A hypocrite and a conservative. This is a strong right arm of the worst Kruddy Gileadism if ever there was one. Fuck him and all the sexist Alternative Liberal Party bullies that sail in him. I looked up ' stuffed - shirt' the other day and it said ' See Lindsay Tanner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What a piece of work is Lindsay Tanner!<br />
A nosebleed elitist. A sexist swine. A reactionary piece-of-shit from way back.<br />
A hypocrite and a conservative. This is a strong right arm of the worst Kruddy Gileadism if ever there was one. Fuck him and all the sexist Alternative Liberal Party bullies that sail in him. I looked up &#8216; stuffed - shirt&#8217; the other day and it said &#8216; See Lindsay Tanner.</p>
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		<title>By: Debbieanne</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458916</link>
		<dc:creator>Debbieanne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 04:25:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458916</guid>
		<description>I'm a Qlder, never heard of them either. Hopefully it is rationalisation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a Qlder, never heard of them either. Hopefully it is rationalisation.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Tyro Rex</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458907</link>
		<dc:creator>Tyro Rex</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 03:47:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458907</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;
cutting useful programs
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

We don't know that the program is question is actually "useful" do we? OK, some Labor members, according to Mark, are lobbying against the cut. I'm a Labor member, I've seen plenty of Labor members in my time resort to knee-jerk reactions against government policy of all persuasions. I think the jury is still out on this one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>
cutting useful programs
</p></blockquote>
<p>We don&#8217;t know that the program is question is actually &#8220;useful&#8221; do we? OK, some Labor members, according to Mark, are lobbying against the cut. I&#8217;m a Labor member, I&#8217;ve seen plenty of Labor members in my time resort to knee-jerk reactions against government policy of all persuasions. I think the jury is still out on this one.</p>
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		<title>By: Alastair</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458897</link>
		<dc:creator>Alastair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 03:08:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458897</guid>
		<description>"We know there's going to be pain in this budget"

That's either stupid spin or stupid actions. With our economy in good shape and with a large budget surplus there is no reason why there should be 'pain' in this budget. Yes they need to avoid wasteful spending but that shouldn't mean cutting useful programs.

The Reserve Bank is moderating inflation with interest rates and an already guaranteeed large budget surplus will help as well. I think they are going too far with certain cuts. These will do next to nothing to help the economy, but will harm certain groups of people. Seems just plain stupid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;We know there&#8217;s going to be pain in this budget&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s either stupid spin or stupid actions. With our economy in good shape and with a large budget surplus there is no reason why there should be &#8216;pain&#8217; in this budget. Yes they need to avoid wasteful spending but that shouldn&#8217;t mean cutting useful programs.</p>
<p>The Reserve Bank is moderating inflation with interest rates and an already guaranteeed large budget surplus will help as well. I think they are going too far with certain cuts. These will do next to nothing to help the economy, but will harm certain groups of people. Seems just plain stupid.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458878</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:29:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458878</guid>
		<description>That the funding will be discontinued from next financial year due to a budget decision. Not happy!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That the funding will be discontinued from next financial year due to a budget decision. Not happy!</p>
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		<title>By: Amanda</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458876</link>
		<dc:creator>Amanda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:27:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458876</guid>
		<description>What does the letter say? What do the WWS say?  What do the unions say?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What does the letter say? What do the WWS say?  What do the unions say?</p>
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		<title>By: Fine</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458875</link>
		<dc:creator>Fine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458875</guid>
		<description>I was wondering that myself, Mark. But, we know there's going to be pain in this budget.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was wondering that myself, Mark. But, we know there&#8217;s going to be pain in this budget.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458873</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:11:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458873</guid>
		<description>Amanda, I'm told the centres themselves have been informed by letter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amanda, I&#8217;m told the centres themselves have been informed by letter.</p>
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		<title>By: Spiros</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458872</link>
		<dc:creator>Spiros</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:10:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458872</guid>
		<description>"I wonder if any of this reaction would be different if this decision had been made by Peter Costello and Joe Hockey."

Of course, because their motives would have been bad.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I wonder if any of this reaction would be different if this decision had been made by Peter Costello and Joe Hockey.&#8221;</p>
<p>Of course, because their motives would have been bad.</p>
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		<title>By: Amanda</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458871</link>
		<dc:creator>Amanda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:09:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458871</guid>
		<description>Well its all a bit hazy as pre-Budget Chinese whispers tend to be.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well its all a bit hazy as pre-Budget Chinese whispers tend to be.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458868</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:57:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458868</guid>
		<description>I think it's a fair bet that it has been since the people I spoke to are lobbying against it, Amanda.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s a fair bet that it has been since the people I spoke to are lobbying against it, Amanda.</p>
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		<title>By: Amanda</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458865</link>
		<dc:creator>Amanda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:50:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458865</guid>
		<description>If any such decision has in fact been made.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If any such decision has in fact been made.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458864</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:45:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458864</guid>
		<description>I wonder if any of this reaction would be different if this decision had been made by Peter Costello and Joe Hockey.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder if any of this reaction would be different if this decision had been made by Peter Costello and Joe Hockey.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Spiros</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458863</link>
		<dc:creator>Spiros</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:43:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458863</guid>
		<description>"I’d have thought it would be better policy to review them rather than just treat them as a line item in the budget to be deleted. That’s what I’m told happened.

In an ideal world, yes. But reviews take time and the budget is imminent. 

"The point goes to the lack of consultation with these decisions".

Sometimes governments have to stop farting around and just make decisions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I’d have thought it would be better policy to review them rather than just treat them as a line item in the budget to be deleted. That’s what I’m told happened.</p>
<p>In an ideal world, yes. But reviews take time and the budget is imminent. </p>
<p>&#8220;The point goes to the lack of consultation with these decisions&#8221;.</p>
<p>Sometimes governments have to stop farting around and just make decisions.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458860</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Apr 2008 01:37:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/04/21/rhetoric-reality-rudd/#comment-458860</guid>
		<description>I don't see the fact that we're very lucky to have seen the back of John Howard as a good reason never to criticise Rudd's government, Paul!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see the fact that we&#8217;re very lucky to have seen the back of John Howard as a good reason never to criticise Rudd&#8217;s government, Paul!</p>
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