Saturday Salon

An open thread, where at your weekend leisure, you can discuss anything you like.

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44 Responses to “Saturday Salon”


  1. 1 joe2No Gravatar

    Frost!

  2. 2 David RubieNo Gravatar

    y’all better be set for watching Cadel Evans take Le Tour for the next three weeks. I’d love to see Robbie McEwan kicking some serious butt too, but the general consensus is that there just aren’t enough lead-out men in the Silence-Lotto squad due to a serious effort in trying to support Cadel. I want to see a little more aggression out of him this year - and FFS no more drug scandals.

  3. 3 SGNo Gravatar

    Surely there is no serious butt to kick amongst cyclists? Just padding?

    I went to the Pitt Rivers Museum of Anthropology in Oxford on Thursday, to find some artifacts from the Japanese town where I lived. This trip raised 2 issues:

    1. I saw real shrunken heads. That’s gross man (picture on my blog).

    2. The artifacts I was looking for were part of a collection donated by the great Basil Hall Chamberlain. They had been stuffed in a drawer and weren’t properly catalogued. This particular collection was a gift, but there was lots of other stuff there that wasn’t, I’m sure. It calls into question the “we can’t give you back your bones because you won’t take care of them” excuse when they are just stuffing the stuff out of sight somewhere. I was rather disgruntled.

    I didn’t get to see the artifacts, which means I have failed to discharge an obligation for a Japanese priest. Which I suppose raises the third issue of how, precisely, I should kill myself…

  4. 4 AmbigulousNo Gravatar

    Heavy frost!

    Ieng Sary, former Khmer Rouge “Foreign Minister” on trial before a Tribunal in Phnonh Penh, has pleaded that a royal amnesty granted to him in 1996 by “King Norodom Sihanouk” should mean he can’t be tried. His wife Ieng Thirith (sister-in-law of the deceased Pol Pot) is also facing trial. And a small number of others including the guy they put in charge of the Tuol Sleng detention centre, Douch.

    cheerio

  5. 5 AmbigulousNo Gravatar

    David Rubie

    and we watch it for the vistas of French countryside and towns - tres belle, toujours!

  6. 6 Nana LevuNo Gravatar

    I see Hersh has an article in the latest New Yorker
    Preparing the Battlefield
    The Bush Administration steps up its secret moves against Iran.
    Late last year, Congress agree to a request from President Bush to fund a major escalation of covert operations against Iran …..
    http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/07/07/080707fa_fact_hersh?currentPage=all

  7. 7 Paul BurnsNo Gravatar

    Back in TV land, with the Tour Dew France - Was Adam shot in the head in his car at the end of Spooks kast nught, or am I just suffering from bad eye-sight?

    Returning to the real world - we might all be lucky. Apparently the US Army doesn’t have the military capacity at the moment5 to take on a war in Iran. Newvetheless, given we currently have a US President whose brain was destroyed long ago by too much booze and cocaine long beforee he became President to impress his father,there’s no knowing what the irresaponsible moron will do.

  8. 8 SGNo Gravatar

    The Yorkshire Ranter judges the risk of war in Iran by the number of carriers in or able to get to the Persian Gulf.

  9. 9 Graham BellNo Gravatar

    j-p-z …. and all you other Yankees:

    Happy Independence Day!

    [Yeah, I know, it’s 5th July here on the other side of the International Date Line :-) ]

  10. 10 The Worst of PerthNo Gravatar

    SG, I was on my way to that museum specifically to see shrunken heads, but stopped off at the Eagle and Child (baby?) for a pre head drink and became horribly fascinated by an American couple at the next table gabbin about god. (They also thought “pints” were too big.) They were explaining to their child that Jesus making a mistake in Joseph’s carpentry workshop(eg sawing a piece of wood the wrong length) would not have been a sin, just a mistake. I borrowed a pencil from the barman to write down the gibberish, then ended up reeling out of the pub too pissed and late for the shrunken heads. Next time in The UK, the heads are first on my list.

  11. 11 BrianNo Gravatar

    Paul B my wife and I watched Spooks last night. I think you’re right, Adam’s gone. My wife reckons she’s been expecting it for some time. I think it’s more than the pragmatics of the actor is moving on to another project so they’ve got to kill him/her off or phase them out with a new identity. It’s meant to be part of the existential dangers of the job, I think.

    Then there was that remark by Harry “Some-one’s not going to turn up to work tomorrow morning” and does that connect with the initial interchange between Harry and the other govt guy? I was a bit tired, but sometimes it’s hard to nut it all out.

  12. 12 RayedishNo Gravatar

    I think I must have watched a different version of spooks to you guys!
    The govt. official was followed by two guys from Mossad in a dark van, punishment for putting them on the wrong track, and Adam was having nasty flash backs, but I didn’t see him get killed but it looks as though is he getting all angsty over his wife and the nanny and his son, while I think he probably a goner eventually it looks as though they are going to stretch it out for a couple more weeks, cos he wasn’t shot last night.

  13. 13 Paul BurnsNo Gravatar

    “… will be the most memorable epocha in the history of America. I am apt to believe it will be celebrated by succeeding generations as the great anniversary festival.It ought to be commemorated as the day of deliverance, by solemn acts of devotion to God Almighty. It ought to be solemnized with pomp and parade, with games, sports, guns, bells, bonfires, and illumninations, from one end of this continent to the other, from this time forward and forever more.” John Adams to Abigail Adams,Philadelphia, 3 July, 1776.)
    John Adams famously picked the wrong date, (2 July)but you get my drift.
    American Lp-ers, Happy Independence Day from me as well.
    (Fortuitously, I happen to be reading the Adams letters at the moment.)

  14. 14 DeeCeeNo Gravatar

    Or was it just part of Adam’s “flashes” - inc flash of his son shot in the head?

    On the coming “Climate Change” campaigns… I did enjoy Adele Horin’s As the right goes green, Nelson is the odd man out in this morning’s SMH http://www.smh.com.au/news/opinion/as-the-right-goes-green-nelson-is-the-odd-man-out/2008/07/04/1214951039335.html

    Couple this with Rupert Murdoch’s conversion to green printing (at least in the UK … & I suppose, other states with ETSs), and I wonder how the Opposition & NewsLtd are going to play ETS in Australia! I suppose it will back MalT when he makes the running - unless, of course, Brendan the Weathervane comes to a “bi-partisan” stance, and actually sticks to it.

  15. 15 MarkNo Gravatar

    I thought the sleazy lawyer type was going to be killed by Mossad, and that’s what Harry was talking about, and that’s what the last scene implied. But obviously Adam is in major crisis mode.

    Excellent ep, I reckon!

  16. 16 FineNo Gravatar

    My interpretation is the same as Rayedish’s. I was and still am suffering from horrendous jet-lag and last night had a magor glass of redwine to wind down with, so I could have been watching anything. But that blonde Hermione chick kicks serious butt.

    Just back from two weeks in France, for a trade fair in La Rochelle and a week’s holiday in Paris. I’m so feeling the Melbourne winter cold, but looking forward to Chambermade Opera tonight if I can stay awake.

  17. 17 rfNo Gravatar

    Ah! All the Spooks fans are out this week! It is the only show on TV which I am not prepared to miss. Everything else is very missable.
    When I heard them say on the TV “and next, the federal politician who wants radars banned” I immediately thought “Wilson T” and unsurprisingly I was right. Wilson Tuckey - defender of the truth or something and nothing to do with his recent speeding ticket. The voters of O’Connor should hang their heads in shame for continually re-electing him.

  18. 18 Paul BurnsNo Gravatar

    Yeah,
    I thought it was the sleazy lawyer was going to get it - but then at the end I thought Adam had a bullet in the head.
    Guess we’ll find out next week.

  19. 19 BrianNo Gravatar

    I was struggling a bit, which shows how tired I was and me missus wasn’t much better, so I’ll go with Mark for the mo. His visual literacy always used to be pretty good, I think.

    Generally I don’t like it when they invent somewhat phony personal crises, and I didn’t like the way they got rid of Zoe way back. It wasn’t in character. But Adam’s problems are credible enough.

  20. 20 BrianNo Gravatar

    Now my wife reckons Adam is going to walk away, thereby demonstrating that you really can’t have any normal relationships and do the job.

  21. 21 Lefty ENo Gravatar
  22. 22 RayedishNo Gravatar

    IMHO Spooks is one of the best shows in Tv at the moment, but if they do kill Adam off I won’t be happy. This is one show where they are quite prepared to be brutal to their main characters though.

  23. 23 Enemy CombatantNo Gravatar

    Just when you thought it was safe to get your hands around a hard copy Garnaud and perfectly timed to chime in with Sydney’s environmentally sensitive WYD……

    “Vatican Tightens Nocturnal Emissions Standards:

    VATICAN CITY—The Vatican has released a strict new set of Church laws intended to reduce the nocturnal emissions of teenage polluters by 50 percent in the next decade, Cardinal Antoni Bertoli announced Monday….”

    http://www.theonion.com/content/news/vatican_tightens_nocturnal?utm_source=slate_rss_1

    (bottom two “Enlage Image”s recommended)

  24. 24 naskingNo Gravatar

    We’ve selected the 100% Green energy option w/ Origin Energy. Mostly wind I here. No pun intended.

    Correction: recently i made the mistake of writing that Craig Emerson was our local Fed Minister. In fact, it’s Brett Raguse. Big winner Brett. Sometimes I confuse the two because my wife mentions Emerson so much as he visits her workplace sometimes.

    Was pleased to get newsletters from both Raguse…& State member Evan Moorhead this week…sounds like Labor is on the ground again & putting money & effort into some worthwhile projects. Also, glad to see someone finally got that Tugan Bypass completed. Good on Bligh & her lot. Takes time & repetition of message & various methods of SELLING for accomplishments to SINK IN. A family member visited, usually votes National Party but swung to Rudd, she listens to NONSENSE on TV of late and repeats the BS on fuel, pensions, childcare, water etc…& seems to be heeding a MESSAGE that going on-line is filled w/ UNTRUTHS, so stick to papers & TV. Sigh. Wrong word of mouth in small towns can INFECT like a virus.

    And as for Murdoch & going green…well he’s the OPPORTUNIST as ever…& ensures many speak w/ forked tongue for him. Think O’Reilly there…& moderates here & in UK. He’ll have the increasingly evangelical-like FEMINISTS rooting for the stars & stripes & crosses alliance (signs, signs everywhere) before ya know it…wanting to bite the knobs off Iranians…it’s such a minefield when you don’t trust your sense of real LIGHT.

    And speaking of O’Reilly (who looks richer & sounds more “blut und boden” by the day) and his forked tongue show…it seems that HE’S BACK!

    Yep, Dick Morris is back to FLEECE us…the man who knows how to work w/ the Corporate/Dynastic Chess Players and twist INTEGRITY words like a Neo-Con artist and construct a parallax view within the Game. I wonder if he sits with his head in the ever-evolving CLOUD & reflects on bikinis down at the Atoll?:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Morris

    Watched the other day ‘No Country for Old Men’…certainly need to reflect on it.

    Like ZODIAC. Was it the journo?

    Tonite: The Darjeeling Limited, The Assassination of Jesse James…& American Gangster.

  25. 25 dannyNo Gravatar

    There was just a most marvellous program on Radio national, “John Curtin: Portrait of a Prime Minister”, originally made in 1960.
    If you haven’t heard him making the announcement of government taking control of the economy and of Australia’s commercial and industrial structure in an effort to rally national resources behind the war effort, it really is worth a listen ( either tomorrow at 6am, yeh right, or when they put up the podcast, “Life and Times” is the show) if just for the contrast of the authority and courage on display in his voice, and their lack in today’s version of Labor Leader Lite.
    Next week it’s “Chif”

  26. 26 Lefty ENo Gravatar

    Shorters Spooks:

    “ive got some serious, sexy crap to tell you”.

  27. 27 Don WiganNo Gravatar

    Danny, I’m up at that time for my taxi shuft - so I’ll listen to the RN bio on Curtin.

    Some time back RN ran a series on Curtin’s letters. I didn’t catch all of it, but there were some interesting exchanges. In one with Menzies, both leaders showed great integrity and respect for each other (something I didn’t expect from Ming).

    In my opinion the outstanding feature of Curtin and Chifley is their humility. Neither saw themselves as anything but ordinary Australians, and it showed in their relations with others. It is a trait which seems to be missing from many of our current leaders. Don Dunstan, despite his public persona as an egoist, also possessed humility. There were plenty not quite at the top such as John Button, Jim Killen or Barry Jones. But alas, the present system seems to demand ego-driven keaders.

    Curtin arguably remains our most interesting leader for his humanity. He overcame what should have been daunting setbacks such as alcoholism, cowardice and self-doubt to lead Australia through its darkest hours. He must have known his relentless overseeing would weaken and kill him but he could not cease. He carried the fears not for his own safety but his soldiers and citizens who depended on him getting it right.

  28. 28 naskingNo Gravatar

    I’m a Rudd/Gillard team fan. They’ve learnt important lessons from Chifley & Curtin, positives, negatives, adapting to circumstances, not being wedged on ‘fear-mongering’ stuff like “Reds/Islamics under the bed”. Not having to live out of a hotel is another. Being TOUGH. There is a LIGHT on the hill.

    Hearing about the freedom of Ingrid Betancourt led me to this:

    Luis Carlos Galán

    Galán was largely influenced by Pierre Teilhard de Chardin ideas and Nikos Kazantzakis’s books. His father Mario described him as a person fascinated with spirituality, the man with integrity, an individual struggle for knowing one’s self between good and evil and that the effort to achieve it consisted in the main objective in life, not only individually, but collectively.[2]

    «La sensibilidad social del autor, el hombre integral que buscaba y la lucha interna que Kazantzakis padeció y soportó a través de su vida entre el ángel y la bestia, entre la naturaleza interior y superior del hombre, entre el mundo pasional y el espíritu, lo fascinaban dice su padre- la búsqueda de esa trascendencia espiritual y el esfuerzo para realizarlo constituía para Luis Carlos el objetivo de la vida, no solamente en lo individual sino también en lo colectivo».

    “ Once again the Colombian men turn passionate; but their passion is not that of the parties, the one that perverted their spirits and pushed thousands of countrymen to death towards phantoms of selfish ideals. Now our passion is Colombia and we believe in this ideal as the only one capable of uniting the whole country.”

    - Luis Carlos Galán - Revista Vértice, May 1964.

    “ For Colombia, always forward, not a single step backwards, and whatever is a necessity let it be.

    (wiki pedia)
    ————-

    And who would’ve thought that Huffington Post, 23/6 (satirical news) & Dickipedia (not Wikipedia) would connect themselves to a Death Star-like entity (see Barry Diller & IAC - InterActiveCorp)…goes to SHOW…that you can’t trust much coming out of the New Roman Empire.

    Clones everywhere. If it ain’t one soft drink, it’s another. If it ain’t one sports clothing franchise, it’s another…same goes for fast food. And social networking sites. Two-sides of the same coin. Some alternatives eh?…blaaah.

    There always tracking our movements, likes, dislikes…views…always adapting…killer virus…w/ big maw, chameleons.

    N’

  29. 29 DannyNo Gravatar

    Don: yeh, I’ll go with you on Don (the Dunston one) being quite an unassuming bloke to meet. But he had an air of, I dunno, gravitas, about him. So did PJK. I don’t detect it with Kev. Therese will have the monopoly on it in that family.

    He could grow it I suppose, I certainly hope so. You’d think it would occur to him just how stupid it looks for him to make an incredibly important decison, like to let Brumby get away with murdering the murray, and only after its all over, and the damage of bad faith done, only then to actually visit the lakes(?) and say “you know what stuns me, is how bad things are”.

    Somehow I think Curtin would have visited first, decided after. I hope someone makes Kev listen to the show. Then again, I thought the apology speech was a pretty ordinary effort, so what would I know.

    It’s a bit frightening to think about it and realise how our party-ist system, where we vote for who- or what-ever one machine or other spits out, isn’t one that guarantees talent, or even sincerity, gets the gong. Quite the opposite: I was surprised when I got to see the front bench up close (at a community cabinet) just how ordinary they mostly actually are.

  30. 30 RobertNo Gravatar

    Commenting to acknowledge the words from Don Wigan.

    To hold them in my hands a moment, the word ‘greatness’ comes to mind, as something lost, in modern comparisons. The core word ‘great’ remains today, as shell, gutted also by overuse but to read Don’s comment reconnects to a time when the understanding of greatness was something to aspire to, and nowadays the dripping stain in your memory’s grasp laments not only for those who cared not for it, or denied it altogether, but the bulk today who never knew that word at all.

    Indeed, we are living in a time when the world has lost sight of it.

    Upon consideration this is pretty wild. What might have happened, if a positive is allowed to live, is that the shift is taking place whereby the person seeking it elsewhere now makes real of their own greatness.

    To say so, flying in the face of what is thrashed about your head as ‘human nature’ being that people are ultimately self-interested, is the stuff of dreaming. Delusion, madness, and naiveté. “We’re not to convene with the gods, for by that very definition they exist outside of you”.

    Yet to believe in humanity is to believe in how a person handles daily challenge, in his or her own way, and come up for the greater good, beyond the childlike me-ness as how it’s boxed back and sold, and consumed, though that is hidden spectacularly.

    No; in the face of massive potent challenge, I think people are going better than well. When leadership is lacking, though it kills us slowly in the lapse, people do take hold themselves. And if we are delivered a blancmange of journeymen who present without a greatness, we take it upon ourselves to find it anyway. Again, if a positive is allowed to live, it would be that a shift from power of the singular outsourced leader to the ‘greatness’ within, bit by difficult bit, is being embraced by those who’d never consider the question of it.

    We’ve lost great leadership, as it has been understood, or framed, throughout history. But these are brave new times, and I’ll back the new world in, including the way it’s being led.

  31. 31 naskingNo Gravatar

    “Somehow I think Curtin would have visited first, decided after. I hope someone makes Kev listen to the show. Then again, I thought the apology speech was a pretty ordinary effort, so what would I know.”

    Danny, you sound more like Piers Ackerman, than a Laborite.

    Perhaps find yerself a time machine, grab the Labor war boys, bring them back here & point them in the direction of Iraq. You might be surprised by their response.

  32. 32 Pavlov's CatNo Gravatar

    You’d think it would occur to him just how stupid it looks for him to make an incredibly important decison, like to let Brumby get away with murdering the murray, and only after its all over, and the damage of bad faith done, only then to actually visit the lakes(?) and say “you know what stuns me, is how bad things are”.

    Word, Danny (she said from Adelaide).

  33. 33 AmbigulousNo Gravatar

    danny and PC

    the modern PM always puts the photo opportunity before the deep thought, does he not? Scripted, scripted, scripted…..

  34. 34 Don WiganNo Gravatar

    Danny,I agree that there’s got to be more urgency with the Rivers system. And there’s a chance with the new Bligh leadership plus the disarray of the NSW Govt (suggesting they could be pushed into agreeing) to get out the cotton and rice growers and change the mentality upriver of ‘opening up’ new areas to irrigation. It does require a bit of boldness and preparedness to face down some angry farmers and regional communities. Does Rudd have it? I hope so. Ditto with global warming.

    I think you’re a bit hard on him re the apology. The outstanding feature of that I thought was that there were no qualifiers, no statements about ‘…made with the best intentions…” - just an admission of wrong.

    Robert: some excellent thoughts. I do hope you’re right and individuals rise to the challenge. It is part of our past, of course. We had some woeful colonial administrators at times and virtually had to take local initiatives.

    I remember at one time being very angry with the Hawke Government about something and thinking of the analogy with Thackeray’s novel “Vanity Fair” especially the subtitle “A Novel without a Hero”. I was thinking out government was a bit like that, including the vanity bit. Obviously I was harsh. It’s clear now that the hawke Government was one of our best, and it did indeed have some heroes, especially further down the food chain.

  35. 35 KimNo Gravatar

    Adam rocks.

    Just sayin…

  36. 36 NabakovNo Gravatar

    Finally acquired Kokoda Crescent on DVD. Few other Australian films have managed to blend drama, humour and pathos so well while also deftly and laconically observing what made diggers rather different from most other countries’ armed forces.

    “I was never a soldier, I was a civilian! OK, a heavily armed civilian I grant you.”

  37. 37 adrianNo Gravatar

    Those of you Spooks fans who have access to the internet should check out the Spooks web site. Adam’s fortunately not going anywhere. The other good news is that there are many episodes to come, as the ABC is screening the 5th series I think, and they are currently screening the 7th in the UK.

  38. 38 Paul BurnsNo Gravatar

    Apooks rock!
    Now all we need is for the ABC to get the rights to all of Torchwood (including the truncared 1sr series disgracefully cut off by ch. 10) and we’ll never have to worry about global watming again. :)

  39. 39 Paul BurnsNo Gravatar

    Suppose this is the place to announce it. I’m now on broadband instead of dial-up

    Meant Spooks rock!
    And global warming.

  40. 40 joe2No Gravatar

    Hey, Paul you will find it cheaper, in the long run, as well.
    Only trouble is you get phone calls.

  41. 41 KimNo Gravatar

    Throw away the phone, and buy a cheap mobile on prepaid not on a plan. Then you get no spam phone calls!

  42. 42 Paul BurnsNo Gravatar

    Kim,
    Am registered on the Do not Call register. Seems to work for the most part. And when I do get a telemarketer I abuse them for taking Australian jobs,and suggest they unionise, so they usually hang up.

  43. 43 Graham BellNo Gravatar

    Nabakov [36]:

    “Kokoda Cresent” sounds like an interesting film - hadn’t heard of it before.

    Wonder if anyone has tried to sell it on the European Union market? With a plot like that, it would be a real goer. [This is 2008, there are no dubbing/subtitling problems …. only dubbing/subtitling procedures].

  44. 44 j_p_zNo Gravatar

    “Jesse H, come to our pit:*
    All-ages show.”**
    – Sonic Youth, “Chapel Hill”

    * — meaning, mosh-pit.
    ** — no ID required, but there’s a pun.

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