<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Is neoliberalism finished?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/</link>
	<description>Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 14 Feb 2012 08:06:05 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Adrien</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218876</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2008 07:02:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218876</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Passing these ideas off as some kind of Althusser-style ideology of prejudices and taboos is a cheap shot — and one which is also taken by the other side.&lt;/i&gt;
.
The &#039;other side&#039; always sees your ideology clearer than you do.
.
To &#039;you&#039; ideology is just good sense based on evidence. Any cursory examination of political discourse shows that to be true. In economics it depends on what you&#039;re looking at &lt;i&gt;and what you value&lt;/i&gt;. There&#039;s been a marked unity of policy in the world since c 1980 generally identified with &#039;neoliberalism&#039; that is: the post-Keynsian return to laissez-faire discourse associated with Milton Friedman and the like.
.
Naturally this &#039;laissez-faire&#039; is a misleading term. There is not now, now has there ever been a laissez-faire economy except in those times perhaps when all humans were hunter-gatherers. But even that&#039;s nonsense. In any event there are ideological twists of the truth all &#039;round. The references to some fictional history of the US and UK economies in order to get developing nations to lower their tariff walls is one such instance. Both the States and Britain practiced strict protectionism for their infant industries.
.
If you want to see ideology at work just check out all the: it&#039;s the govt&#039;s fault/it&#039;s the market&#039;s fault argument viz the Current Great Mess. Unsurprisingly the arguments fall along the same old lines.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Passing these ideas off as some kind of Althusser-style ideology of prejudices and taboos is a cheap shot — and one which is also taken by the other side.</i><br />
.<br />
The &#8216;other side&#8217; always sees your ideology clearer than you do.<br />
.<br />
To &#8216;you&#8217; ideology is just good sense based on evidence. Any cursory examination of political discourse shows that to be true. In economics it depends on what you&#8217;re looking at <i>and what you value</i>. There&#8217;s been a marked unity of policy in the world since c 1980 generally identified with &#8216;neoliberalism&#8217; that is: the post-Keynsian return to laissez-faire discourse associated with Milton Friedman and the like.<br />
.<br />
Naturally this &#8216;laissez-faire&#8217; is a misleading term. There is not now, now has there ever been a laissez-faire economy except in those times perhaps when all humans were hunter-gatherers. But even that&#8217;s nonsense. In any event there are ideological twists of the truth all &#8217;round. The references to some fictional history of the US and UK economies in order to get developing nations to lower their tariff walls is one such instance. Both the States and Britain practiced strict protectionism for their infant industries.<br />
.<br />
If you want to see ideology at work just check out all the: it&#8217;s the govt&#8217;s fault/it&#8217;s the market&#8217;s fault argument viz the Current Great Mess. Unsurprisingly the arguments fall along the same old lines.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Leon</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218875</link>
		<dc:creator>Leon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2008 06:47:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218875</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Academics, armchair economists, libertarians and House Republicans are the only ones who take the “principles” of neoliberalism seriously. Governments here and across the Atlantic only stick with it in as far as it entrenches the rule of capital.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

The right has provided an equally persuasive theory of why academics, armchair radicals, public servants, and arts students are the only ones who take the &quot;principles&quot; of Marxism seriously: that they are disaffected middle class idealists, with little experience in the non-public economy.

You can&#039;t just play the dialectical materialist, class forces card to dismiss views. Barely anyone in Australia devotes their time to discussing the finer points of Austrian economics. The actual institutions of &quot;neoliberalism&quot; -- for example, think tanks like the CIS -- devote their time to arguing for their policy ideas, at the best of times with appeals to evidence and shared values. Passing these ideas off as some kind of Althusser-style ideology of prejudices and taboos is a cheap shot -- and one which is also taken by the other side.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Academics, armchair economists, libertarians and House Republicans are the only ones who take the “principles” of neoliberalism seriously. Governments here and across the Atlantic only stick with it in as far as it entrenches the rule of capital.</p></blockquote>
<p>The right has provided an equally persuasive theory of why academics, armchair radicals, public servants, and arts students are the only ones who take the &#8220;principles&#8221; of Marxism seriously: that they are disaffected middle class idealists, with little experience in the non-public economy.</p>
<p>You can&#8217;t just play the dialectical materialist, class forces card to dismiss views. Barely anyone in Australia devotes their time to discussing the finer points of Austrian economics. The actual institutions of &#8220;neoliberalism&#8221; &#8212; for example, think tanks like the CIS &#8212; devote their time to arguing for their policy ideas, at the best of times with appeals to evidence and shared values. Passing these ideas off as some kind of Althusser-style ideology of prejudices and taboos is a cheap shot &#8212; and one which is also taken by the other side.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Andrew E</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218874</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew E</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 11:45:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218874</guid>
		<description>A bit like Keynesianism really: fun while it lasted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A bit like Keynesianism really: fun while it lasted.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218873</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 09:27:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218873</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;(oh you dont know about the name change in WW1 from Hapsburg to Windser?)&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Nope, it wasn&#039;t from Hapsburg who were the (Catholic) Imperial House of Austria.

&lt;blockquote&gt;By virtue of Queen Victoria&#039;s marriage to Prince Albert of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha – son of Duke Ernst I of the small German duchy of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha – her descendants were members of the ducal family of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, with the house name of Wettin. Victoria&#039;s son, Edward VII, and, in turn, his son, George V, reigned as members of this house.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Windsor

But this seems, well, a touch off topic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>(oh you dont know about the name change in WW1 from Hapsburg to Windser?)</p></blockquote>
<p>Nope, it wasn&#8217;t from Hapsburg who were the (Catholic) Imperial House of Austria.</p>
<blockquote><p>By virtue of Queen Victoria&#8217;s marriage to Prince Albert of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha – son of Duke Ernst I of the small German duchy of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha – her descendants were members of the ducal family of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, with the house name of Wettin. Victoria&#8217;s son, Edward VII, and, in turn, his son, George V, reigned as members of this house.</p></blockquote>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Windsor" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Windsor</a></p>
<p>But this seems, well, a touch off topic.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: OldSkeptic</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218872</link>
		<dc:creator>OldSkeptic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 09:25:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218872</guid>
		<description>Adien. Heh, heh, heh.

Ah the &#039;useful idiots&#039;, tell the poor that god loves them better because they are poor, but god has a special place for the rich. EG the Anglicans, their head of church is the head of a country, yep Bessie talks to god all the time, which probably explains lot about the Hapsburgs (oh you dont know about the name change in WW1 from Hapsburg to Windser?), as well as the genetic inbreeding.

god bless them (actually I first typed &quot;god less them&quot; .. which is a much better idea actually).

If there really is a god, don&#039;t you think she/he would be really, really pissed off right now?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adien. Heh, heh, heh.</p>
<p>Ah the &#8216;useful idiots&#8217;, tell the poor that god loves them better because they are poor, but god has a special place for the rich. EG the Anglicans, their head of church is the head of a country, yep Bessie talks to god all the time, which probably explains lot about the Hapsburgs (oh you dont know about the name change in WW1 from Hapsburg to Windser?), as well as the genetic inbreeding.</p>
<p>god bless them (actually I first typed &#8220;god less them&#8221; .. which is a much better idea actually).</p>
<p>If there really is a god, don&#8217;t you think she/he would be really, really pissed off right now?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Adrien</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218871</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 08:54:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218871</guid>
		<description>Old Skeptic - It ain&#039;t the death of meaning you commie. It&#039;s the comin&#039; of the Rapture. Halleluhah! We&#039;s a goin&#039; up ta Heaven ta sit at the right hand of the Lord and watch you all get nooked by Martians.
.
That&#039;s what Jesus meant went he said &#039;the meek will inherit the Earth&#039;. He meant we&#039;s the one&#039;s gits five star rooms in God&#039;s Hilton Palace and y&#039;all get scorched dirt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Old Skeptic &#8211; It ain&#8217;t the death of meaning you commie. It&#8217;s the comin&#8217; of the Rapture. Halleluhah! We&#8217;s a goin&#8217; up ta Heaven ta sit at the right hand of the Lord and watch you all get nooked by Martians.<br />
.<br />
That&#8217;s what Jesus meant went he said &#8216;the meek will inherit the Earth&#8217;. He meant we&#8217;s the one&#8217;s gits five star rooms in God&#8217;s Hilton Palace and y&#8217;all get scorched dirt.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: OldSkeptic</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218870</link>
		<dc:creator>OldSkeptic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 08:46:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218870</guid>
		<description>Oh lads, neo-liberalism was always a class war. A political idiotology to redress all the wrongs that the nut jobs and the greedy thought that happened after WW2. A weird fantasy to try and go back to some mythological British late 19th century paradise, where the upper classes got rich and the lower classes knew their place, and there was no pesky middle classes to get in the way. Oh the end of the USSR was nirvana, it meant they could pull of that idiot velvet glove and just get in with the iron fist, pre-emptively.

Back to a glorious (fantasy) past, where money making was the pursuit of gentlemen, trading deals with each other and there was always force (or death or indefinite prison or deportation) to make sure the lower classes knew their place. A boot crushing into their faces all the time.

As usual there were all sorts of sycophants to justify it. The mouthpieces, for a little bit of money they would say anything. To my eternal credit (not that I actually deserve much) I tried in some small ways in the 80’s and 90’s to raise a voice against it. And found out very quickly how nasty it really was, Govt officers ringing up my clients to say I was a (quote) ‘a charlatan’. I so loved a year of unemployment due to these clowns (boys ... my time now).

Oh I remember lots of (what I call) data points along the way. Terry Mcrann arguing in the late 80&#039;s about sacrificing 25% of the population economically (which we actually did here in Oz anyone who believes the official unemployment numbers is an idiot). Or that great term &#039;titty socialism&#039;, from one of those great elite meetings (which I call greedy morons gobbing over greedy morons). Or even, one of the Murdoch/Packer (forgot which one) clan rabbiting on about the problem with “Australian elites&quot;, and he was what?

None of these idiots had any understanding of modern societies, technology or wealth creation.

The death of science in the Anglo nations, the inventers of this nonsense. The death of manufacturing. The death of rationality. The death of anything meaningful but mindless consumption and watching &#039;big brother&#039;, while the big boys made their squillions. Oh and do you remember all the justifications for this, how much money we would all make. Productivity would climb, wealth would be made endlessly. I still await my millions from that arch neo-liberal clown Keating.

All while the &#039;big boys&#039; made gobs of money, nothing was too much, a hundred million, a billion, a trillion. All off our backs.

Bail them out? I have a better idea this is a real use for Guantanimo Bay. Daily water boarding I say ... after torture.

But Dudd has the answer, Workchoices lite, more emigration (especially low skilled workers .. yes your wages have to drop even more from those miserably low levels), cut research .. et al. Oh and cut tariffs on textiles  and car manufacturing even more .. we really don’t have enough poor people (or a big enough trade deficit).

You know I remember when the left were the smart people, we saved capitalism from itself and developed systems to generate wealth for everyone. Here’s a radical thought why don’t we actually try that again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh lads, neo-liberalism was always a class war. A political idiotology to redress all the wrongs that the nut jobs and the greedy thought that happened after WW2. A weird fantasy to try and go back to some mythological British late 19th century paradise, where the upper classes got rich and the lower classes knew their place, and there was no pesky middle classes to get in the way. Oh the end of the USSR was nirvana, it meant they could pull of that idiot velvet glove and just get in with the iron fist, pre-emptively.</p>
<p>Back to a glorious (fantasy) past, where money making was the pursuit of gentlemen, trading deals with each other and there was always force (or death or indefinite prison or deportation) to make sure the lower classes knew their place. A boot crushing into their faces all the time.</p>
<p>As usual there were all sorts of sycophants to justify it. The mouthpieces, for a little bit of money they would say anything. To my eternal credit (not that I actually deserve much) I tried in some small ways in the 80’s and 90’s to raise a voice against it. And found out very quickly how nasty it really was, Govt officers ringing up my clients to say I was a (quote) ‘a charlatan’. I so loved a year of unemployment due to these clowns (boys &#8230; my time now).</p>
<p>Oh I remember lots of (what I call) data points along the way. Terry Mcrann arguing in the late 80&#8242;s about sacrificing 25% of the population economically (which we actually did here in Oz anyone who believes the official unemployment numbers is an idiot). Or that great term &#8216;titty socialism&#8217;, from one of those great elite meetings (which I call greedy morons gobbing over greedy morons). Or even, one of the Murdoch/Packer (forgot which one) clan rabbiting on about the problem with “Australian elites&#8221;, and he was what?</p>
<p>None of these idiots had any understanding of modern societies, technology or wealth creation.</p>
<p>The death of science in the Anglo nations, the inventers of this nonsense. The death of manufacturing. The death of rationality. The death of anything meaningful but mindless consumption and watching &#8216;big brother&#8217;, while the big boys made their squillions. Oh and do you remember all the justifications for this, how much money we would all make. Productivity would climb, wealth would be made endlessly. I still await my millions from that arch neo-liberal clown Keating.</p>
<p>All while the &#8216;big boys&#8217; made gobs of money, nothing was too much, a hundred million, a billion, a trillion. All off our backs.</p>
<p>Bail them out? I have a better idea this is a real use for Guantanimo Bay. Daily water boarding I say &#8230; after torture.</p>
<p>But Dudd has the answer, Workchoices lite, more emigration (especially low skilled workers .. yes your wages have to drop even more from those miserably low levels), cut research .. et al. Oh and cut tariffs on textiles  and car manufacturing even more .. we really don’t have enough poor people (or a big enough trade deficit).</p>
<p>You know I remember when the left were the smart people, we saved capitalism from itself and developed systems to generate wealth for everyone. Here’s a radical thought why don’t we actually try that again.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: wizofaus</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218869</link>
		<dc:creator>wizofaus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 05:40:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218869</guid>
		<description>I suppose I generally accept the simplest explanation as to why many goverments have pursued policies like WorkChoices: because industrial lobbyists have convinced them that if they don&#039;t, industries will either move offshore or go broke and Australia will become an economic backwater - the &quot;race to the bottom&quot; theory.  This despite a long history of similar threats from industries in the past that have rarely come to pass, and the fact that to fall for such lobbying you effectively have to not believe that capitalism works: that if corporations moved offshore or went bust, others couldn&#039;t possibly step in and work out how to be profitable in their place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suppose I generally accept the simplest explanation as to why many goverments have pursued policies like WorkChoices: because industrial lobbyists have convinced them that if they don&#8217;t, industries will either move offshore or go broke and Australia will become an economic backwater &#8211; the &#8220;race to the bottom&#8221; theory.  This despite a long history of similar threats from industries in the past that have rarely come to pass, and the fact that to fall for such lobbying you effectively have to not believe that capitalism works: that if corporations moved offshore or went bust, others couldn&#8217;t possibly step in and work out how to be profitable in their place.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Adrien</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218868</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 05:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218868</guid>
		<description>wizofaus - I&#039;m a supporter of minimal interference in my business but not by any means a dogmatic opponent of regulation. Just sayin&#039;.
.
The thing about neoliberalism and the &#039;free market&#039; rhetoric of people like George Dubya and Johhnie Coward is that it&#039;s total crap. What they mean is that the rules that the rest of us are bound by do not apply to multinational corporations.
.
In an ideal world people should be free to make their own deal viz the labour market. The argument that minimum wages for example locks people out of the job market does have a certain validity. However eliminating them seems to create serfs for a Darwinian nightmare. What can you do?
.
Thanks of course to the experiences of Mr Howard and Stanley Bruce we won&#039;t have the Libs trying that one again any time soon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wizofaus &#8211; I&#8217;m a supporter of minimal interference in my business but not by any means a dogmatic opponent of regulation. Just sayin&#8217;.<br />
.<br />
The thing about neoliberalism and the &#8216;free market&#8217; rhetoric of people like George Dubya and Johhnie Coward is that it&#8217;s total crap. What they mean is that the rules that the rest of us are bound by do not apply to multinational corporations.<br />
.<br />
In an ideal world people should be free to make their own deal viz the labour market. The argument that minimum wages for example locks people out of the job market does have a certain validity. However eliminating them seems to create serfs for a Darwinian nightmare. What can you do?<br />
.<br />
Thanks of course to the experiences of Mr Howard and Stanley Bruce we won&#8217;t have the Libs trying that one again any time soon.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: wizofaus</title>
		<link>http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218867</link>
		<dc:creator>wizofaus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 05:20:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/09/29/is-neoliberalism-finished/#comment-218867</guid>
		<description>Adrien, perhaps, but Howard wasn&#039;t the only driving force behind WorkChoices.  Costello (and others) presumably supported it to the extent that it supposedly liberalised the labor market.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adrien, perhaps, but Howard wasn&#8217;t the only driving force behind WorkChoices.  Costello (and others) presumably supported it to the extent that it supposedly liberalised the labor market.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

