Comments on: I'll believe it when I see the charging posts… http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/ Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas Tue, 14 Feb 2012 09:53:20 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: adrian http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212767 adrian Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:30:28 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212767 I don't know if it's 'Thatcherite', but it's certainly tedious. I thought that the ability to 'think outside the square' to use the common jargon, is highly prized these days. I think in reality we are less imaginative than we used to be, and less open to new ideas. I don’t know if it’s ‘Thatcherite’, but it’s certainly tedious. I thought that the ability to ‘think outside the square’ to use the common jargon, is highly prized these days. I think in reality we are less imaginative than we used to be, and less open to new ideas.

]]> By: Huggybunny http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212766 Huggybunny Tue, 28 Oct 2008 22:58:50 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212766 Wilful, there is absolutely no reason why you and the other denizens of your street should not club together and organise a row of unobtrusive power points (with RCD's) down your street. You can each have a RFID thingy to activate the point and direct the cost to you. (The RFID gadget makes them intrinsically safe BTW as there will be no power until the RFID reader is swiped after the plug is inserted) I grow tired of this standard Thatcherite response to any-thing new. Huggy Wilful, there is absolutely no reason why you and the other denizens of your street should not club together and organise a row of unobtrusive power points (with RCD’s) down your street. You can each have a RFID thingy to activate the point and direct the cost to you. (The RFID gadget makes them intrinsically safe BTW as there will be no power until the RFID reader is swiped after the plug is inserted)
I grow tired of this standard Thatcherite response to any-thing new.
Huggy

]]> By: carbonsink http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212765 carbonsink Tue, 28 Oct 2008 07:42:48 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212765 JoelP @ 40 wrote: <blockquote>Actually they’ve all been very willing to raise the price of energy in recent years, with more to come</blockquote> Perhaps you could enlighten me. Please do tell me the name of a politician who has put his or her name to a bill that has raised energy prices through taxation, ETS or otherwise. JoelP @ 40 wrote:

Actually they’ve all been very willing to raise the price of energy in recent years, with more to come

Perhaps you could enlighten me. Please do tell me the name of a politician who has put his or her name to a bill that has raised energy prices through taxation, ETS or otherwise.

]]> By: Chris (a different one) http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212764 Chris (a different one) Tue, 28 Oct 2008 04:59:01 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212764 wilful @ 44 - yes, though would the areas with little off street parking generally be those in higher density inner city areas where public transport services are generally better? Car recharging would also be an issue for many appartments as well where there simply isn't the infrastructure yet. Anyway I think until they can get the capital costs down to more reasonable levels (or fuel costs rise enough) its not going to get widespread adoption. wilful @ 44 – yes, though would the areas with little off street parking generally be those in higher density inner city areas where public transport services are generally better? Car recharging would also be an issue for many appartments as well where there simply isn’t the infrastructure yet.

Anyway I think until they can get the capital costs down to more reasonable levels (or fuel costs rise enough) its not going to get widespread adoption.

]]> By: wilful http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212763 wilful Tue, 28 Oct 2008 04:15:41 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212763 different Chris, I understand that arguing by anecdote can be a distraction, but I'm not on my pat malone here - very few people in my suburb have off street parking. This is a major issue with car recharging. different Chris, I understand that arguing by anecdote can be a distraction, but I’m not on my pat malone here – very few people in my suburb have off street parking. This is a major issue with car recharging.

]]> By: Chris (a different one) http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212762 Chris (a different one) Tue, 28 Oct 2008 02:16:51 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212762 wilful @ 42 - its not about getting a solution for everyone, just for a large proportion of people. As a second car it would suit very many people, and personally, with only one car, I'd be happy with a range of only 100km and just hire a car in the fairly rare occasions when we need more. Wouldn't buy one at twice the cost of an ordinary car though! wilful @ 42 – its not about getting a solution for everyone, just for a large proportion of people. As a second car it would suit very many people, and personally, with only one car, I’d be happy with a range of only 100km and just hire a car in the fairly rare occasions when we need more. Wouldn’t buy one at twice the cost of an ordinary car though!

]]> By: wilful http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212761 wilful Tue, 28 Oct 2008 01:55:06 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212761 Tediously, as a practical point, I live in a suburb with little off-street parking. I don't have a reserved spot in front of my house and I have no property right to such a spot. Rechargeable cars would require me (and nearly everyone in my street) to garage my car off-site, at a new facility built for that purpose (and there's soo much spare land for new effing car parks in the inner suburbs). So what's the practical solution there? Also, I know arguing by anecdote is tedious, but most of the kilometres my car does (>10 000 per annum) is 230 km to near Benalla. Do I really have to stop at Avenel for a while to get a recharge? Will hotswappable batteries ever exist for a wide variety of vehicles by different manufacturers? Do I have to pay my mum for the electricity? Hmmm, colour me sceptical. Tediously, as a practical point, I live in a suburb with little off-street parking. I don’t have a reserved spot in front of my house and I have no property right to such a spot. Rechargeable cars would require me (and nearly everyone in my street) to garage my car off-site, at a new facility built for that purpose (and there’s soo much spare land for new effing car parks in the inner suburbs). So what’s the practical solution there?

Also, I know arguing by anecdote is tedious, but most of the kilometres my car does (>10 000 per annum) is 230 km to near Benalla. Do I really have to stop at Avenel for a while to get a recharge? Will hotswappable batteries ever exist for a wide variety of vehicles by different manufacturers? Do I have to pay my mum for the electricity?

Hmmm, colour me sceptical.

]]> By: Huggybunny http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212760 Huggybunny Tue, 28 Oct 2008 00:51:50 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212760 Hrgh, No the charger is actually in the car itself - in all the EV's that I have inspected - you plug it into any ordinary power point it recharges the battery at 2.35 kWh/h if you plug into a standard 10A point or twice this if you install a 20A socket (it knows which one you use). Thus a 10A socket will completely recharge a 10 kWh battery in about 4 and a bit hours. At a cost of about 50 cents for the whole 4 hours (based on an off peak rate of $0.10/kWh). If you then drive a round trip of say 25 km you get a "fuel" cost of 2 cents/km. That seems to me to be a big incentive to actually stagger over to the power point and plug the thing in every night - you can get the power point put onto a night tariff . The 10 A power point is actually about right for most batteries. Huggy Hrgh,
No the charger is actually in the car itself – in all the EV’s that I have inspected – you plug it into any ordinary power point it recharges the battery at 2.35 kWh/h if you plug into a standard 10A point or twice this if you install a 20A socket (it knows which one you use). Thus a 10A socket will completely recharge a 10 kWh battery in about 4 and a bit hours. At a cost of about 50 cents for the whole 4 hours (based on an off peak rate of $0.10/kWh).
If you then drive a round trip of say 25 km you get a “fuel” cost of 2 cents/km.
That seems to me to be a big incentive to actually stagger over to the power point and plug the thing in every night – you can get the power point put onto a night tariff . The 10 A power point is actually about right for most batteries.
Huggy

]]> By: JoelP http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212759 JoelP Tue, 28 Oct 2008 00:34:23 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212759 "Of course, no-one can raise capital for anything at the moment, and the last thing any politician wants to do is raise the price of energy." Actually they've all been very willing to raise the price of energy in recent years, with more to come. “Of course, no-one can raise capital for anything at the moment, and the last thing any politician wants to do is raise the price of energy.”

Actually they’ve all been very willing to raise the price of energy in recent years, with more to come.

]]> By: adrian http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212758 adrian Mon, 27 Oct 2008 23:40:28 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2008/10/27/ill-believe-it-when-i-see-the-charging-posts/#comment-212758 Brian @ 35. Looks as though Peugeot/Citroen (PSA) is doing just that, but who knows how long it will take to reach the market, given the cost differential: <a href="http://www.citroen.com/CWW/en-US/TECHNOLOGIES/ENVIRONMENT/C4HYBRIDE/" rel="nofollow">LINK</a> Brian @ 35. Looks as though Peugeot/Citroen (PSA) is doing just that, but who knows how long it will take to reach the market, given the cost differential: LINK

]]>