Comments on: The politics of the Senate vote on the stimulus package http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/ Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas Tue, 14 Feb 2012 11:27:53 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: feral sparrowhawk http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174815 feral sparrowhawk Fri, 13 Feb 2009 08:22:48 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174815 It should be noted that if Xenophon had not run his seat would have gone to a Liberal (probable outcome in SA 3 Libs, 3 Lab, possible 3 libs, 2 Lab, 1 Green, rather than the 2 Libs, 2 Lab, 1 X, 1 Green we got) So without Xenophon Turnball would have been able to block this and anything else he wanted as long as he could hold the Nationals in line. It should be noted that if Xenophon had not run his seat would have gone to a Liberal (probable outcome in SA 3 Libs, 3 Lab, possible 3 libs, 2 Lab, 1 Green, rather than the 2 Libs, 2 Lab, 1 X, 1 Green we got)

So without Xenophon Turnball would have been able to block this and anything else he wanted as long as he could hold the Nationals in line.

]]> By: Nick http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174814 Nick Fri, 13 Feb 2009 07:39:48 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174814 This is kinda OT, but just read the Bernard Keane article, and I can't help myself. He linked to <a href='http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25025519-7583,00.html' rel="nofollow">Glenn Milne</a> in Monday's Australian, who somewhat cryptically ('Xenophon was much taken with it behind the scenes'?) chose to reference a <a href='http://www.newyorker.com/talk/financial/2009/01/26/090126ta_talk_surowiecki' rel="nofollow">James Surowiecki</a> article in the The New Yorker: <i>The sting in the tail for Rudd in the Surowiecki piece is his references: "One explanation for why rebates don't have a bigger impact is they don't affect what Milton Friedman called people's permanent income," he writes. "Friedman argued that people's spending is determined by what they think their incomes will be over time; they change their spending habits only if they think they're going to be permanently wealthier or poorer." Some one should tell Xenophon, before he gets down to serious negotiations with Rudd this week ahead of Thursday's Senate vote, that's the same Friedman a certain prominent essayist in the latest edition of The Monthly would willingly identify as one of the bete noirs of neo-liberalism.</i> Someone should tell Glenn Milne that Surowiecki immediately proceeded to dismiss Friedman's permanent-income hypothesis as outmoded and faulty. Talk about selective comprehension. This is kinda OT, but just read the Bernard Keane article, and I can’t help myself.

He linked to Glenn Milne in Monday’s Australian, who somewhat cryptically (‘Xenophon was much taken with it behind the scenes’?) chose to reference a James Surowiecki article in the The New Yorker:

The sting in the tail for Rudd in the Surowiecki piece is his references: “One explanation for why rebates don’t have a bigger impact is they don’t affect what Milton Friedman called people’s permanent income,” he writes.

“Friedman argued that people’s spending is determined by what they think their incomes will be over time; they change their spending habits only if they think they’re going to be permanently wealthier or poorer.”

Some one should tell Xenophon, before he gets down to serious negotiations with Rudd this week ahead of Thursday’s Senate vote, that’s the same Friedman a certain prominent essayist in the latest edition of The Monthly would willingly identify as one of the bete noirs of neo-liberalism.

Someone should tell Glenn Milne that Surowiecki immediately proceeded to dismiss Friedman’s permanent-income hypothesis as outmoded and faulty. Talk about selective comprehension.

]]> By: Ken Lovell http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174813 Ken Lovell Fri, 13 Feb 2009 06:06:20 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174813 Since a bike path around this place could quite conceivably save my life, I'm very happy for youse all to join me in kicking in $50. Since a bike path around this place could quite conceivably save my life, I’m very happy for youse all to join me in kicking in $50.

]]> By: Mark http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174812 Mark Fri, 13 Feb 2009 05:07:02 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174812 Yep, that's right, Chris. Yep, that’s right, Chris.

]]> By: Chris http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174811 Chris Fri, 13 Feb 2009 05:05:22 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174811 David @ 38 - Isn't the Greens who negotiated away that $50? But you will have extra bike paths around the place to compensate! David @ 38 – Isn’t the Greens who negotiated away that $50? But you will have extra bike paths around the place to compensate!

]]> By: Mark http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174810 Mark Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:47:35 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174810 <b>Update</b>: <a href="http://blogs.crikey.com.au/pollytics/2009/02/13/turnbull-praying/" rel="nofollow">Possum</a> on why Turnbull was praying that Xenophon would vote for the package today, <a href="http://publicpolity.wordpress.com/2009/02/13/playing-the-balance-of-power/" rel="nofollow">Sam Clifford</a> assessing the role of the minors in Senate negotiations, and <a href="http://www.crikey.com.au/Politics/20090213-A-Xenophon-stunt-on-a-massive-scale.html" rel="nofollow">Bernard Keane</a> on Xenophon. Update: Possum on why Turnbull was praying that Xenophon would vote for the package today, Sam Clifford assessing the role of the minors in Senate negotiations, and Bernard Keane on Xenophon.

]]> By: moz http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174809 moz Fri, 13 Feb 2009 03:52:26 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174809 I would absolutely love to see Rudd suddenly discover a backbone. The cotton and rice farmers would be as good a place to start as any, but there's also a bunch of frankly stupid laws about what can be built in bushfire areas (alternatively: the greenies won't let people buy bush-clad hills then subdivide and clearfell them to build houses. One of those has to change... I know which I prefer), we subsidise some really dumb things and refuse to subsidise sensible ones (coal and wind power respectively, for instance). If he thinks that's all a bit soft he could have another go at an emissions reduction scheme (not a trading scheme, a reduction scheme). I would absolutely love to see Rudd suddenly discover a backbone. The cotton and rice farmers would be as good a place to start as any, but there’s also a bunch of frankly stupid laws about what can be built in bushfire areas (alternatively: the greenies won’t let people buy bush-clad hills then subdivide and clearfell them to build houses. One of those has to change… I know which I prefer), we subsidise some really dumb things and refuse to subsidise sensible ones (coal and wind power respectively, for instance). If he thinks that’s all a bit soft he could have another go at an emissions reduction scheme (not a trading scheme, a reduction scheme).

]]> By: Don Wigan http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174808 Don Wigan Fri, 13 Feb 2009 03:28:55 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174808 Well, I don't think we should be too hard on X. Sure, he held out a day, and later he didn't get exactly what he wanted anyway. But in a small way he has helped accelerate Murray-Darling action and intervention. And the sooner that is speeded up the better. Mind you, it's not clear how effective any of it may be until the pollies gather enough guts to take on the upstream irrigators. Although it may not be good news for the locals, the plug may have to be pulled on cotton and rice. It's the coalition that have come out of this really badly. The decision to oppose the measures outright did more than just annoy businesses and community groups. It closed off their options for negotiating a deal as the others have done. The silver lining for the government is that they could now move against the upstream powers without fearing their opponents using populist tactics against them. Oppostion credibility (and support ratings) is so low that they would get nothing from beating the drum against seizing leases. Well, I don’t think we should be too hard on X. Sure, he held out a day, and later he didn’t get exactly what he wanted anyway. But in a small way he has helped accelerate Murray-Darling action and intervention. And the sooner that is speeded up the better.

Mind you, it’s not clear how effective any of it may be until the pollies gather enough guts to take on the upstream irrigators. Although it may not be good news for the locals, the plug may have to be pulled on cotton and rice.

It’s the coalition that have come out of this really badly. The decision to oppose the measures outright did more than just annoy businesses and community groups. It closed off their options for negotiating a deal as the others have done.

The silver lining for the government is that they could now move against the upstream powers without fearing their opponents using populist tactics against them. Oppostion credibility (and support ratings) is so low that they would get nothing from beating the drum against seizing leases.

]]> By: David Rubie http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174807 David Rubie Fri, 13 Feb 2009 02:35:25 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174807 That bugger Xenephon owes me $50. That bugger Xenephon owes me $50.

]]> By: fehowarth http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174806 fehowarth Fri, 13 Feb 2009 02:10:48 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/02/12/the-politics-of-the-senate-vote-on-the-stimulus-package/#comment-174806 "Turnbull was denying reality tonight by suggesting that the present situation was entirely of Rudd’s making and left his economic strategy in tatters. And Turnbull is supposed to be the most intelligent person in the parliament!" Turnbull may be smart. Problem is that he sees us as stupid. “Turnbull was denying reality tonight by suggesting that the present situation was entirely of Rudd’s making and left his economic strategy in tatters. And Turnbull is supposed to be the most intelligent person in the parliament!”

Turnbull may be smart. Problem is that he sees us as stupid.

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