Comments on: Faith based community http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/ Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas Tue, 14 Feb 2012 02:20:23 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Fourcultures http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138444 Fourcultures Sat, 15 Aug 2009 12:17:38 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138444 For a serious interpretation of the poles of American political views you could look at the <a href="http://www.culturalcognition.net/" rel="nofollow">Cultural Cognition project</a> coming out of Yale Law School. The rest just reminds me of reading Asterix comic books ("They're crazy, these Romans!"). For a serious interpretation of the poles of American political views you could look at the Cultural Cognition project coming out of Yale Law School. The rest just reminds me of reading Asterix comic books (“They’re crazy, these Romans!”).

]]> By: Adrien http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138443 Adrien Thu, 13 Aug 2009 10:31:41 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138443 <i>Well that worked out well didn’t it?</i> . For the likes of KBR and Halliburton - yes. Well that worked out well didn’t it?
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For the likes of KBR and Halliburton – yes.

]]> By: Elise http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138442 Elise Thu, 13 Aug 2009 10:03:54 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138442 Fran @124: Great Murdoch quote “The greatest thing to come out of this for the world economy, if you could put it that way, would be $20 a barrel for oil. That’s bigger than any tax cut in the any country.” Bet the oil companies thought $20/barrel oil would be a great outcome, too? "Well that worked out well didn’t it?" Just goes to show, Fran, that even the great Murdoch should stick to what he knows best; namely selling newspapers. ;) Fran @124: Great Murdoch quote “The greatest thing to come out of this for the world economy, if you could put it that way, would be $20 a barrel for oil. That’s bigger than any tax cut in the any country.”

Bet the oil companies thought $20/barrel oil would be a great outcome, too?

“Well that worked out well didn’t it?”

Just goes to show, Fran, that even the great Murdoch should stick to what he knows best; namely selling newspapers. ;)

]]> By: Sean http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138441 Sean Thu, 13 Aug 2009 06:30:34 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138441 "People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn't have a chance in the UK, where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless." Investor's Business Daily editorial this week. Even the "Isrealis were kept home on 9-11" crowd know which city the twin towers were in. Japerz is wrong, the right wing nuttiness is qualitatively worse and has pwerful backers to boot. "The Base" are starting to look like space ship cultists after the space ship fails to arrive. “People such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn’t have a chance in the UK, where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless.”

Investor’s Business Daily editorial this week.

Even the “Isrealis were kept home on 9-11″ crowd know which city the twin towers were in.

Japerz is wrong, the right wing nuttiness is qualitatively worse and has pwerful backers to boot. “The Base” are starting to look like space ship cultists after the space ship fails to arrive.

]]> By: Fran Barlow http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138440 Fran Barlow Thu, 06 Aug 2009 13:44:55 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138440 <blockquote>wars are almost always about resources – considering the ties between the administration and the oil business – almost everyone in that room owed their fortune to it – considering the rubbery justifications for the war, I think the assertion is entirely reasonable.</blockquote> <blockquote>Murdoch backs 'courageous' Blair over Iraq Tuesday February 11 2003</blockquote> <blockquote>Rupert Murdoch has given his full backing to war, praising George Bush as acting "morally" and "correctly" and describing Tony Blair as "full of guts" for going out on a limb in his support for an attack on Iraq. </blockquote> {...} <blockquote>He reiterated that the "greatest thing to come out of this [war]" would be cheap oil, which he believes would benefit the world economy more than any tax cut ever could </blockquote> ... <blockquote>On the war Mr Murdoch was equally unequivocal."We can't back down now. I think Bush is acting very morally, very correctly, and I think he is going to go on with it," he said. "The fact is, a lot of the world can't accept the idea that America is the one superpower in the world," he added. </blockquote> <blockquote>Mr Murdoch said the price of oil would be the war's main benefit on the world economy. "The greatest thing to come out of this for the world economy, if you could put it that way, would be $20 a barrel for oil. That's bigger than any tax cut in the any country." </blockquote> Well that worked out well didn't it?

wars are almost always about resources – considering the ties between the administration and the oil business – almost everyone in that room owed their fortune to it – considering the rubbery justifications for the war, I think the assertion is entirely reasonable.

Murdoch backs ‘courageous’ Blair over Iraq
Tuesday February 11 2003

Rupert Murdoch has given his full backing to war, praising George Bush
as acting “morally” and “correctly” and describing Tony Blair as “full
of guts” for going out on a limb in his support for an attack on
Iraq.

{…}

He reiterated that the “greatest thing to come out of this [war]”
would be cheap oil, which he believes would benefit the world economy
more than any tax cut ever could

…

On the war Mr Murdoch was equally unequivocal.”We can’t back down now.
I think Bush is acting very morally, very correctly, and I think he is
going to go on with it,” he said. “The fact is, a lot of the world can’t accept the idea that America is the one superpower in the world,” he added.

Mr Murdoch said the price of oil would be the war’s main benefit on
the world economy. “The greatest thing to come out of this for the world economy, if you could put it that way, would be $20 a barrel for oil. That’s bigger
than any tax cut in the any country.”

Well that worked out well didn’t it?

]]> By: Adrien http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138439 Adrien Thu, 06 Aug 2009 07:20:21 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138439 JPZ - <i>Well, the American MSM have been (and remain) Obama’s instrument, therefore whatever else they may be, they aren’t particularly righteous.</i> . I take it therefore that Fox, who tried as hard as possible to ignore Obama last year, are not main stream? . Don't get me wrong there is a cult of personality around the man and such things tend to paint a glossy, smooth picture. They breed fanatcisim. I don't approve. . However they gets away with it because of partisan infighting. During the Bush/Howard era people opposed to their foreign policy would've noticed the 1950s <i>Pravda</i> type diatribes stemming from the News Ltd crew. In the early phase of the War on Terrorism and especially pre-Iraq many of them went so far as to declare that anyone who suggested that the Bush administration's true motivation in Iraq was oil was insane or evil. . However considering the history of warfare - wars are almost always about resources - considering the ties between the administration and the oil business - almost everyone in that room owed their fortune to it - considering the rubbery justifications for the war, I think the assertion is entirely resonable. In fact I think that the media had a duty to debate the matter. They did not. And this was largely the result of a successul PR campaign that painted anyone doing that as a Jihadist sympathizer. News Ltd led the way. . The result? All those cowardly knaves in the Democrats who knew good and damn well that the war was wrong - voted for it. . Now the wheel's come full circle and the conservatives are getting a taste of their own medicine. Mr Obama may turn out to be a mediocrity or a disaster but as a PR guru he is outstanding. . May I suggest that the key to this is to put aside the ideological ping pong and agree that facts, a certain objectivity, a certain pluralism and a return to the days of skepticism and openness might be called for? Politicians can afford to igniore those who don't endorse them. If the liberals were suspicious of Obama and the conservatives of Bush than these guys wouldn't get away with the stuff they do. . <i>Hell, I still remember the folks who thought the letters of Ronald Reagan’s name indicated 666, the Mark of the Beast.</i> . Preposterous. Everyone knows that Bill Gates is the Anti-christ. :) JPZ – Well, the American MSM have been (and remain) Obama’s instrument, therefore whatever else they may be, they aren’t particularly righteous.
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I take it therefore that Fox, who tried as hard as possible to ignore Obama last year, are not main stream?
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Don’t get me wrong there is a cult of personality around the man and such things tend to paint a glossy, smooth picture. They breed fanatcisim. I don’t approve.
.
However they gets away with it because of partisan infighting. During the Bush/Howard era people opposed to their foreign policy would’ve noticed the 1950s Pravda type diatribes stemming from the News Ltd crew. In the early phase of the War on Terrorism and especially pre-Iraq many of them went so far as to declare that anyone who suggested that the Bush administration’s true motivation in Iraq was oil was insane or evil.
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However considering the history of warfare – wars are almost always about resources – considering the ties between the administration and the oil business – almost everyone in that room owed their fortune to it – considering the rubbery justifications for the war, I think the assertion is entirely resonable. In fact I think that the media had a duty to debate the matter. They did not. And this was largely the result of a successul PR campaign that painted anyone doing that as a Jihadist sympathizer. News Ltd led the way.
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The result? All those cowardly knaves in the Democrats who knew good and damn well that the war was wrong – voted for it.
.
Now the wheel’s come full circle and the conservatives are getting a taste of their own medicine. Mr Obama may turn out to be a mediocrity or a disaster but as a PR guru he is outstanding.
.
May I suggest that the key to this is to put aside the ideological ping pong and agree that facts, a certain objectivity, a certain pluralism and a return to the days of skepticism and openness might be called for? Politicians can afford to igniore those who don’t endorse them. If the liberals were suspicious of Obama and the conservatives of Bush than these guys wouldn’t get away with the stuff they do.
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Hell, I still remember the folks who thought the letters of Ronald Reagan’s name indicated 666, the Mark of the Beast.
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Preposterous. Everyone knows that Bill Gates is the Anti-christ. :)

]]> By: Jenny http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138438 Jenny Thu, 06 Aug 2009 03:08:22 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138438 J_P_Z @ 118: I thought that was a very perceptive post, and I totally agree with you. But I don't think we should allow a reasonable argument to stop us mocking republicans for their loony views and people - just think of the fun we would miss out on. J_P_Z @ 118:

I thought that was a very perceptive post, and I totally agree with you. But I don’t think we should allow a reasonable argument to stop us mocking republicans for their loony views and people – just think of the fun we would miss out on.

]]> By: myriad http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138437 myriad Wed, 05 Aug 2009 09:37:51 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138437 Like Molnar I feel that the feeding of people's prejudices is somewhat dismissed or diminished if it is lumped in under the heading of 'Tribalism'. For my own part I also think that's rather disrespectful of tribal traditions, which are highly diverse and don't automatically equate to the most base biological instincts we still have lolling about in our brains. And in timely fashion, <a href="http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/8/5/762024/-Umm,-GOP-You-got-a-second-I-want-to-show-you-something." rel="nofollow">a dailykos diary that makes the point more pertinently than I can (despite the lame title).</a> Like Molnar I feel that the feeding of people’s prejudices is somewhat dismissed or diminished if it is lumped in under the heading of ‘Tribalism’.

For my own part I also think that’s rather disrespectful of tribal traditions, which are highly diverse and don’t automatically equate to the most base biological instincts we still have lolling about in our brains.

And in timely fashion, a dailykos diary that makes the point more pertinently than I can (despite the lame title).

]]> By: Katz http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138436 Katz Tue, 04 Aug 2009 12:49:05 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138436 <blockquote>You seem to think I’m some sort of Republican, or right-winger, or GOP apologist. I’m not.</blockquote> Incorrect. My memory of your political positions is more nuanced than you are prepared to acknowledge. I recall clearly and accept as true your statement that you are mostly a Democrat voter. The "straight line" I referred to is about methodology, not ideology. Though it is true that the persons I mentioned inhabited various points of the right side of the spectrum. In responding to my invitation above, you may interpret "left" as broadly as you like. Ya can't say fairer than that.

You seem to think I’m some sort of Republican, or right-winger, or GOP apologist. I’m not.

Incorrect. My memory of your political positions is more nuanced than you are prepared to acknowledge. I recall clearly and accept as true your statement that you are mostly a Democrat voter.

The “straight line” I referred to is about methodology, not ideology. Though it is true that the persons I mentioned inhabited various points of the right side of the spectrum.

In responding to my invitation above, you may interpret “left” as broadly as you like.

Ya can’t say fairer than that.

]]> By: Ambigulous http://larvatusprodeo.net/2009/08/02/faith-based-community/#comment-138435 Ambigulous Tue, 04 Aug 2009 12:09:57 +0000 http://larvatusprodeo.net/?p=9238#comment-138435 j_p_z as a matter of interest, do you have folks over there who sincerely believe that ALL the nutters reside in the Party they themselves oppose? Or are such folks in tiny minorities? Do you have (possibly other) folks who believe it's valid to build large edifices of (sometimes "psychologising") speculation as part of their political discourse? How's NYC this summer? j_p_z

as a matter of interest, do you have folks over there who sincerely believe that ALL the nutters reside in the Party they themselves oppose? Or are such folks in tiny minorities?

Do you have (possibly other) folks who believe it’s valid to build large edifices of (sometimes “psychologising”) speculation as part of their political discourse?

How’s NYC this summer?

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