Tony Abbott gave an Australia day address in Melbourne last night (a few days early, but what the hey…). The Shorter Tone? Immigrants should adopt Australian values and that Mufti character was dodgy; A big population is good, but John Howard was right about everything, though we should have compassion for asylum seekers.
This, no doubt, is the first of the ‘philosophical’, ‘headland’ speeches which will define Abbott as the very model of a modern Liberal leaderthe ghost of Howardia.
Elsewhere: Andrew Elder.
I love the trope that migrant communities have ‘leaders’ whose word they ‘follow’, like sheep. Course, we all know ‘people like that’ don’t have minds of their own, don’t we?
I’ve worked with, met and befriended migrants of all stripes, including in my own family. But I’ve never known any of them to have ‘leaders’ who speak for them, or whose instructions they defer to.
Funny ol’ world, innit?
Maybe it’s a projection of Tone’s ideal typical Santamarian medieval hierarchical authoritarianism?
BTW, I found the list of Australian values that Tone was referring to…
‘This is the graidescountrinnawurld; everyone on the dole is a bludger; don’t work too hard mate; the Prime Minister’s a bastard but he’s a better bastard than that other bastard; it’s all good; foreigners are all right but why don’t they speak English and why can’t they drive; and I’m not racist but.’
I just commented on Saturday Salon – sorry didnt realise this would be put up -
Is Abbott in the right election campaign? Tone, the BNP is going to the polls in the UK, you dill. And this is our opposition leader! Go for it, Kev and Greens, sic ‘em out.
After the clarity of Malcolm’s Republican article and now Abbott’s dross, you can see why Malcolm drew the line in the sand.
Mark @ 2 what a wonderful sentence! Every word prompts further poetry.
Tony is really hierarchical
His leanings entirely monarchical
Santa Maria’s the man
Who taught him to plan
With casuistry just diabolical
Love it, Patricia WA!
I can’t these idiots haven’t learned the lessons that countless state oppositions have been teaching for over a decade now. That dog simply won’t hunt, monsignor – maybe not even from an incumbent but certainly not from opposition.
How come 98% of the criminals I’ve met (I had a chequered life) were/are born in Australia?
Tones, you should get out more.
Ugh. Yeah, let’s celebrate that totally awesome time when some people showed up to Australia in boats to forever change the culture of the people already here, by letting other people in boats know that they shouldn’t get any bright ideas about coming here ‘cos we’re afraid they’ll change the culture.
This is troubling mainly because Abbot has previously been on the record (repeatedly actually) saying there is very little to worry about in terms of migrant communities (he singled out Muslims) adopting the values he thinks are Australian and has drawn parallels between catholics and muslims.
He was actually a conservative proponent of multi culturalism, so I don’t want him to withdraw from that.
Jeez you lot don’t know much. Oz is perfect just as she. Can’t be improved in any way. Always was perfect, always will be (better before the shielas got the vote, but). Mr Rabbit is going to be PM before the year is out. Get used to it, ya wetties.
RG @ 10,
Yes, but now he’s the Leader of the Liberal Party. And that, btw, is not a sarcastic comment.
The grumpiness continues – the Coalition is going to end up being seen as the grumpy party. Nothing is good, noting is right with a whinging tone, oops, that we haven’t yet get over not having won the last election. Wilson Tuckey has always been grumpy, Greg Hunt struggles to reach the required level of grumpiness without great effort and Julie Bishop heads for the petulant key whenever she comments on anything.
Tone the Moan: ”The inescapable minimum that we insist upon is obedience to the law,”
I would go further and insist that all new arrivals look both ways before crossing the road, dispose of their litter thoughtfully, and when at the beach always bathe between the flags.
And if they don’t want to Vote One Tone, they should fxxx off where they come from.
Did Tone provide any examples of “minority leaders” encouraging their “followers” to break the law?
*/cue crickets
I thought not.
*/cue dogwhistle
“Did Tone provide any examples of “minority leaders” encouraging their “followers” to break the law?”
Well, there is the stacking of a lot of Labor Party branches with members of certain ethnic groups, which is against the law in Queensland.
He cited Halily in one report I read.
Tony probably never spent a whole day in the presence of “my mentor Bob”, and Santamaria never came close to commanding the loyalty of a majority of either Catholics or Italians.
C’mon Mark, you can’t blame Abbott for being every bit as realistic as a typical intellectual (albeit a pre-reformation one) when looking at societal relationships. I thought there were even some female people here who admire that about him—conviction is sexy or something. :=)
There, that’s better.
What law would that be, Sam?
Andrew Elder had a nice comparative analysis of this and a piece in the Australian from Scott Morrison. There is a significant difference between the two approaches, even if they’re both drawing inspiration from the record of a government past.
Mmmm:
Rugby league player gang bangs–(y’know boys will be boys); Shock jock incitement to violence; True blue Aussies (not racists) bashing “wogs” at Cronulla and taking back our country; Crimes against humanity in Iraq as accessories; Blind allegiance to a constitutional but anachronistic monarchy; Blind allegiance to US foreign policy; fuck gay rights and global warming etc etcFecking amazing Tony how many “minority” asshole leaders (along with avoid_”fresh”_meat_Hilaly) we really have, isn’t it?
MigrantsThe Liberal Party would be more popular ifminority leadersits leader encouraged them to adopt more mainstream values…..Many immigrant groups do have community organizations that do more than preserve folk dancing and the playing of bagpipes. For example, the Southern Sudanese communities that I have has limited contact with are actively doing things to help their community in Australia and become good citizens. So Tony is not being completely insane when he appeals to community leaders.
On the other hand the whole tone of what is reported here confirms the suspicion that Tony lacks the discipline and underlying ethics to be a desirable prime minister. There are too many mixed messages and too many incidents that suggest that Tony is flapping his gums without doing the homework required.
@19 – was joking, Nickws.
I do think Abbott’s reflexes are authoritarian, though.
@ Katz 21, Sam 17
“Well, there is the stacking of a lot of Labor Party branches with members of certain ethnic groups, which is against the law in Queensland.”
Sam speaks out of his arse. ALP rules require that you can join -any- branch that covers the state electorate in which you are enrolled. The branch doesn’t matter as much as the SEC area you’re in of course, given that the “power” you have as a member is to vote in preselections. Also to put a motion to the branch to get a motion at the SEC to get a motion into state conference.
The other problem with the “stack” business is that you have a participation requirement before you can vote in a preselection contest. Also, there’s a time-delay mechanism usually that stops you voting in a preselection for at least a year, if not two.
The idea of ethnic stacks are about 20 years out of date.
Of course, if only about 10 members of any ethnic group (or any other group, e.g. religious, social or ideological – what do you think a faction is) decide to all join the ALP and they all live in the same area and they all join the branch they will effectively control that branch, if they act in concert. They’ll also have a fair sized block at state preselections; candidates will court them assiduously, just as I am being courted currently over the Ryan preselection (a pity I’m now in the federal division of Brisbane then!).
Oh I forgot to add, there’s no “law” governing all the above. It’s just the ALP rules. The Liberals have decidedly different rules – for example, you can join any branch you like – which often result in much worse stacking of branches and preselections than the ALP (they counterbalance it by always giving their central admin committee a vote in the preselection).
“Play
Free BirdDog Whistle!”Mixed performance by the Tone. I miss the 80s John Howard Sensation double act 1-2 with Ian “Sinkers” Sinclair.
Howard: Some people [wink wink] don’t fit in
Sinclair: I know, Asians!
Only group I know claiming exemption from law recently were conservative Christians complaining about anti-discrimination law.
But this is mostly Abbott’s musings are the banality you get from conservative leaders playing to their base but avoiding any substantive statements about policy.
Oh Tony Tony Tony.
Yes there are ethnic gangs out there. Dwarfed by white gangs that are far less visible to the public eye though.
Most ethnics I know put white Australians to shame work wise and in obeying the law.
tssk: are they ethnic dwarf gangs or gangs of ethnic dwarves? Tiny little teams of shaming little people.
The genuinely alarming thing about Abbott compared to Howard is that Howard’s racism was a form of cynical political expediency whereas Abbott’s views are clearly the authentic expression of a sick and xenophobic mind. His speech falls just short of stating what he really meant: ‘Listen youse oily bastards, force ya’selves on us if you must but don’t ever forget what we did to the Chinese at Lambing Flat”.
Tyro@27: “the power you have as a member is to vote in preselections” …
Yeh right, like in the State 07 bye for Brisbane Central ..
Like true believer rank and file local branch members would be trusted to do the right thing and make sure the likes of Alistair and Tim, or shudder, Lachlan, and anyone else from PMC who wants to, gets in while the goings good on polishing treasury bench leather ?
I don’t think so … If God had of meant the ALP to be democratic he wouldn’t have invented Rule N40, or allowed last year’s passage of the national executive motion which “prevents state branches even starting the preselection process without the permission of the national executive committee of (Kev and Albanese, Arbib, Butler, Shorten, (Bill) Ludwig)”
Wouldn’t it be fun if Chris Hayes tells head office to shove it, and runs, and almost certainly win, in Wirriwa against Julia’s supposed Laurie Ferguson? If she ever sniffs pre-emptive moves that could put The Succession Deal at risk, (along the lines of f’r'instance Wayne still not having given up believing in His Destiny), things could get very interesting.
Abbott should be calling Hayes, and saying “If you stand for the Greens in Werriwa, (minimising the chance he will just act as a labor stooge when elected as an independent), we’ll get behind you and run dead, with no candidate, do a Fremantle”.
His followup is even worse. The first generation citizens I know take their citizenship very seriously and what they tell their kids reminded me a lot of what my mum used to say to us as welfare recipients. “you are going to stick out and be watched more closely than the lcoals. Don’t shame us.”
In the end what might happen is that ethnic minorities will become less visible, choosing to stay at home when not at work or studying lest their very presence offends the locals.
tssk: yes, there is clear menace in his manner.
Actually, Tony has made a right dick of himself with this speech.
I would expect to see him in customary crawling mode, complete with grovelling air sucks, upon recognition of dumb things said, any mome’ now.
In short, he has gone more base than even his base.
Has he forgotten that they vote too?
Maybe Patricia he’s hoping that ‘good’ immigrants will vote Liberal to prove that they aren’t like those ‘other’ immigrants.
Divide and conquer.
It might turn into another “Shit happens!” moment, joe2.
I’ll tell you what’s Un-Australian: flag-waving and other species of noisy nationalist nonsense.
#40 FTW!
Yeah…I tend to get a bit nervy around people with Southern Cross tatts. Very close minded of me. Pre-Cronulla I would have found the tatt’s quite pretty. Now I see it as a neat warning sign.
tssk: Agreed. Southern Cross tatts. And people who manage the sartorial combination of an Akubra hat, a drizabone raincoat with the split up the back so’s you can ride a horse and rubber thongs (on the feet). In the city. A dead giveaway that someone has gone all out with the symbols of Ozzie identity and fuzed their wires in the process.
Anthony Nolan @43: “Akubra hat, a drizabone raincoat with the split up the back so’s you can ride a horse…”
Best ever compliment to the Aussie outfit in Roros, Norway.
Roros is a historic town in central southern Norway, with a long history of copper mining. They have a wonderful old part of town with miner’s cottages, cobbled streets and the old mine workings converted into a museaum.
You can take this tour back through time through the old town, with a traditional horse and cart (sitting in the cart, rugged up with blankets against the crisp air), to an old-style lodge where you have a slap-up traditional Norwegian dinner. The couple driving the two big horses take turns telling the history of the town and pointing out landmarks. Magic.
I was sitting in the cart, thoroughly enjoying the experience, thinking how very authentic the two tour guides looked… Suddenly it struck me that their outfits actually looked rather authentic as Aussie outback gear. I stared hard at the hat and coat and boots, and thought “Akubra, Drizabone, RM Williams,… surely not???”. Couldn’t quite see to be sure, in the near darkness as night fell.
Finally they noticed me staring at them, and asked if I had a question. Couldn’t help myself. “You haven’t been to Australia, have you?” Affirmative. Now I just had to ask…”They wouldn’t be Drizabones and Akubras, would they?”
God did they ever look embarrassed. I grinned like a Cheshire cat.
Considering the national pride of Norwegians, Aussies could take this as a massive vote of confidence in our traditional outdoor gear!
elise: great tale. The politics of authenticity can be funny, eh?
Id like to see an Australian politician come out and say it: many Australians are wary of American-style showy patriotism and jingoism – and no less proud of the country for that. They wonder what someone wrapped in the flag is trying to flog them.
I reckon it’d go down a treat. Knock this “nationalism-as-majority-ethnic-gang” bullshit on the head.
Here’s my bumper sticker, Ostraya: “Flag waving is for wankers”
Lefty: onya! The ascendancy of flag waving patriotism would have turned the stomach of all of my (now mainly deceased) left wing war veteran mates. It might be the case that generalised Australian distaste for jingoism goes back to the Imperial recruitment campaigns during WWI and the subsequent disillusionment with all forms of unthinking nationalism as opposed to politicised internationalism. The creation and validation of ‘oik’ natonalism is probably Howard’s greatest cultural legacy. I don’t understand any of it: if one is genuinely a proud aussie then how is this reflected by wearing boardies printed with the flag? To my eyes that is an insult.
Its been so long since I’ve been to an Australia Day celebration I can’t remember the last time I went. (It was before JWH corrupted the celebration with his neo-fascist nationalism.)
Paul Burns: the last time I participated in a straya day event was 1988 at the Aboriginal survival day event in Sydney. Huge and solidaristic. A great day. After that I went with the family to survival day events out at La Perouse for a few years (great music and the chance to swim in the surprisingly clean waters of Botany Bay). After that, rien.
The Bicentennial. That really was the start of it, wasn’t it? I enjoyed the history books (well, most of them) but as for the rest, pshaw!
“Yes there are ethnic gangs out there.”
And the onus is on those encouraging immigration from those groups to demonstrate that the crime problems can be addressed. It is deeply unfair for government, which has the role of protecting its citizens, to ignore trends showing some groups are overrepresented in crime. In fact it is negligent.
Particularly, as research is continually revealing population differences. Geoffrey Miller noted this recently in the Economist:
“”We will also identify the many genes that create physical and mental differences across populations, and we will be able to estimate when those genes arose. Some of those differences probably occurred very recently, within recorded history. Gregory Cochran and Henry Harpending argued in “The 10,000 Year Explosion” that some human groups experienced a vastly accelerated rate of evolutionary change within the past few thousand years, benefiting from the new genetic diversity created within far larger populations, and in response to the new survival, social and reproductive challenges of agriculture, cities, divisions of labour and social classes. Others did not experience these changes until the past few hundred years when they were subject to contact, colonisation and, all too often, extermination.
If the shift from GWAS to sequencing studies finds evidence of such politically awkward and morally perplexing facts, we can expect the usual range of ideological reactions, including nationalistic retro-racism from conservatives and outraged denial from blank-slate liberals. The few who really understand the genetics will gain a more enlightened, live-and-let-live recognition of the biodiversity within our extraordinary species-including a clearer view of likely comparative advantages between the world’s different economies.”
http://www.economist.com/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14742737
K Pearleman,
straw men everywhere (to the right and to the left). Have at ‘em with your vorpal blade of inescapable logic.
Quite agree KPearlman: organism, organism, organism – oi, oi, oi.
Someone has to take up the slack when Jack Strocchi is being slack!
Headline of today:
http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/my-views-are-irrelevant-says-liberal-mp-pyne/story-e6frfku0-1225823614233
Christopher Pyne: My views are irrelevant.
“Roger Jones
Jan 26th, 2010 at 1:19 pm
K Pearleman,
straw men everywhere (to the right and to the left). Have at ‘em with your vorpal blade of inescapable logic.”
Well, you do get the impression that some people assume populations are interchangeable. Of course they ignore evidence of group differences in testosterone, MAO-A variants, intelligence and other factors that mediate the likelihood of becoming involved in crime. One way to ameliorate this is to only allow in highly skilled migrants from at risk population groups.
http://www.american.com/archive/2009/august/dealing-with-diversity-the-smart-way
Tony Abbott hasn’t changed his spots any. He has always lacked the political finesse to lead a party to election victory. He needs a strict boss, and without one will vacillate all over the place, as he now is.
Though a dickhead, he isn’t near the dickhead his predecessor is/was. He is a straight talker, not always a wise thing for a political leader.
His physical appearance should not be the subject of scorn, & such comments as above serve only to demean those who would jest at his ears/other anatomical projections.
He can’t help it that his ears look like a Landrover with the doors open, but he can help his “buffness” (as it seems to be called by some)
He is indisputably one of the physically fitter politicians, one of the few, male or female, who could appear in public without a shirt on. At his age most of us could only wish we were in the physical condition he is.
Possible conflict of interest declaration: Tony Abbott has the distinction of one night being the single biggest bar customer of mine ever. Otherwise I’d be a lot more negative about him.
K Pearlman: it is quite correct for you to identify what appear to be genetic and therefore inherited tendencies towards criminality among certain groups. Take the White family, for instance, owners of ‘Belltrees’, that’s the property in the Upper Hunter Valley where Prince Charles used to go to play polo and, incidentally, not too far from Packer’s property just past Moonan Flat up Nundle way. The Whites stole an awesome amount of land on arrival in Australia. They used to brag about how they could ride from Sydney to Brisbane and sleep every night on white land. Sorry, that should read White land. Old grandfather White was an employee of the Australian Agricultural Company and reputedly organised a clearance drive that started around about Port Stephens and concluded somewhere around the back of ‘Belltrees’. At a cliff.
Then, to add insult to injury, his grandson, Patrick, wrote an absoluteluy disgusting passage in “Fringe of Leaves” in which he repeated the frequently made slur against Aboriginals that they were cannibals. Except, of course, that this wasn’t just a yarn at the pub – it was a stomach turning passage written by a master wordsmith. That slur, as I’m sure you know, about cannibalism, occupies pretty much the same space in Australian racist dialogue about Aborigines that the ‘blood libel’ does in other racist dialogues about Jews.
So, there you have it – land theft, genocide and ongoing racist slander and all from the White family. What a mob of criminals. we need to keep people like this out of the country alright.
“we need to keep people like this out of the country alright.”
Right, but in terms of present society the people who tend to have trouble adjusting often come from places that only recently adjusted to agriculture. UC Davis Economist Greg Clark has written about this. See his article responding to comments on his book ‘A Farewell to Alms’ (avail on his faculty page).
Tones does admit to being away with the fairies for 24 hours after he ate some yoghurt hash. (I hate yoghurt.)
K Pearlman:
“people who tend to have trouble adjusting often come from places that only recently adjusted to agriculture.”
Quoi?
Nomads? Goat herders? Free rangers? Expand please.
“Nomads? Goat herders? Free rangers? Expand please.”
I mean hunter gatherer societies in contrast to those that had settled institutionally stable agricultural systems. Adopting agricultural systems lead to metabolic/diet changes like lactose tolerance, many changes in genes involved with infectious disease. Peoples with shorter histories of agriculture tend to have greater difficulties with diabetes or alcoholism.
See the paper ‘Recent acceleration of human adaptive evolution’(Hawks et al 2007) which discusses this. One of the co-authors wrote a book ‘The 10,000 Year Explosion’ which elaborates on it in detail.
Scratch a racist, and you’ll find … a racist. No surprises form K Pearleman.
David Irving,
What exactly have I said that you dispute?
- That some groups are overrepresented in crime?
- That screening for highly skilled migrants would amerliorate the likelihood of migrants ending up in an underclass (particularly as the economy becomes more complex, the need for skilled migrants becomes more important).
Never mind the 10k explosion, the last 150 years are more of a worry. Life in affluent western societies has ‘progressed’ far more than then from when ‘civilisation’ emerged to pre-industrial society.
However, we probably could genetically engineer stomach staples, autobotox skin and wheels instead of feet. Not to mention the future heat tolerant and moisture retaining metabolism we need to cope with the massive global environmental changes. Perhaps then the GOAT HERDING NOMADIC FREE RANGE GENE will become very handy again.
Or Tony Abott will stand for GOAT HERDING NOMADIC FREE RANGE Courses being run along side the hinted Green Army type of thing he wants to raise. Then again he may just do an interview with WW again to proclaim the sanctity of fasting and eating fish on Friday.
Apologies, but these sort of posts do that to me and I have not had my medication yet.
Moderation moi? Maybe I better take my medication now.