An open thread where, at your weekend leisure, you can discuss anything you like.
(Prefer to join a more focussed discussion? Try our recent roundtables for recent lively discussions or browse our archives for topics of interest)
Life, Culture and Politics from BrisVegas
Larvatus Prodeo is an Australian group blog which discusses politics, sociology, culture, life, religion and science from a left of centre perspective. more»
» SUBSCRIBE to LP updates.
Frist!
So who else is excited about the rugby this weekend?
Not many, I fear, Mick.
“Catch Me F_ck Me”, as it is known in the southern and western states of our most excellent commonwealth, does not attract much attention, still less excitement, in those areas of our great brown land.
And you can only watch it on pay TV.
Even so, I will be one of those exploring the mysteries of the scrum and the line out as Australia goes head to head against Seth Efrica on Sunday.
The scrum, in particular, is a beautiful thing.
Its sheer pointlessness is a marvel to behold as whichever team has its player feed the ball into it invariably wins it.
With the other games I am sure you will be with me in cheering on the Argentinians against our rude little brothers and the French against the Cheats. The Irish against the Welsh is a troublesome choice so I wish both teams well.
If your view is that whoever feeds the scrum, wins it, then you can’t have been watching many Australian games in the last five years, Greg.
New Zealand are in mourning for Dan Carter’s groin and on deathwatch for Ruchie’s foot. Not the least John Keys who has called an election four weeks after the final. What are the odds that the Kiwis take it out on him if they don’t win?
Caught The Ups & Downs and The Moffs at The Caravan Music Club last night. Well worth seeing at The Corner tonight if you’re free.
AndrewL: Keys will get back in on personal popularity. And if the ABs win, hey, it’ll be a landslide!
The pathetic media commentary on the counter hegemonic gathering in Wall St rankles. “They make no demands, they lack focus” we are told as if there is a right and proper procedure to the form of protest. Like going to Washington. But this time those counter-hegemons are where it counts, by passing the irrelevance of Washington and going straight to Wall St. And their message is merely “we don’t like it” or, more vigorously, “eff-off” which is why they are such dangerous insurgents – because they make no demands choosing instead to express their disgust and contempt which is, in and of itself, the most unanswerable of demands.
I recently read Bernard Cornwell’s Warlord Chronicles, which is about 5th century AD Britain, and was struck by the similarity between warfare of that time and scrummaging in modern rugby. I wonder if rugby is a continuation of war by other means?
I’ll be watching Ireland-Wales today. I saw the last Ireland match and they were excellent. If they play with the same aggression and pace today I think it might be the best match of the tournament.
At the Conservative party conference in Manchester, Mr Cameron made a rousing speech to the party faithful saying he supported gay marriage ‘because I am a Conservative’
Well there you go … Apparently supporting gay marriage puts The Greens on the far left in Australia and amidst Conservatives in Britain. What does that say?
Of course, not all conservatives were keen:
Lord Tebbutt:
Nothing like an each way bet. You have to laugh.
Oh well, whatever else one can say fairly of Cameron, kudos on this one …
GregM @2
The rugby is on Ch 9 for the finals.
May watch the Oz/NZ match on Sunday if nothing better to do but don’t really care.
Hi all, Paul has asked me to contact you and let you know that he is currently in the Armidale Hospital in the Intensive Care unit. He was very unwell yesterday and is much better today. I will be checking his emails for him and am happy to pass on any messages to him. Regards
T. Rudge
Hi T Rudge,
Would you please pass on to Paul our best wishes and hopes that he will soon be out of hospital
Thanks for keeping us posted T Rudge. What GregM said.
You are a great example of why friends are so important, T Rudge. Please add me to the list of Paul’s well-wishers.
I’m sure that we all wish Paul a speedy recovery.
Here’s wishing Paul a speedy recovery and homecoming, too!
Via T. Rudge to Paul Burns.
I hope your stay in hospital is short and successful.
Recently I stood on the wooden bridge at Concord Massechusetts and thought of you.
I look forward to a speedy resumption of your insightful and compassionate comments.
T Rudge, please pass on my best wishes to Paul for a speedy recovery.
Thanks, T. Rudge, for passing on news of Paul’s hospital visit.
Best wishes, Paul, for a successful recovery.
More of the above from me.
T Rudge, you’re a standup chap/chapette.
AndrewL, after the trepidation and grief the Unzudders went through with Dave Sorensen’s groin problems in farnarkling you’d think that a just God would spare them from the complete failure of Dan Carter’s groin in rugby and its possibility of depriving them of RWC glory in their own land.
What news on Ruchie’s foot?
Rossco thanks for pointing me to Channel 9′s coverage. I’m watching the Irish and Welsh Anthems as I type. I must say that I think the edge lies with the Welsh based upon their relative necklessness, which I have frequently observed as being the key ingredient in the composition of successful six nations rugby teams.
Thanks be to PPRUNE
Something Very Big Is Occupying Wall Street
Financial analyst and commentatar Mike Krieger wrote a great piece yesterday where he discussed the Occupy Wall Street protesters and what’s happening in Lower Manhattan. One of the comments I particularly liked was Mike’s use of Mahatma Gandhi’s great quote to describe how the protesters are being viewed by the powers that be.
“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.” – Mahatma Gandhi
The protesters downtown have moved past the ignore stage as the media blackout has given way to the sheer weight of the story. The strategy has now shifted to discrediting/laughing at/making fun of the protesters. The problem with this phase for the media will be the extremely difficult way it’s going to be to pigeon hole this crowd. They don’t represent the left or the right. They don’t represent the Dems or Repubs, business owners or labor unions, capitalists or socialists, rich or poor, black or white. They represent all of us.
All of the above groups are present and participating in these rallies. The protesters aren’t necessarily anti-capitalist or anti-corporation per se. They are anti the current system. The system that they have no influence over and yet controls their lives. The system that has seen average real wages remain flat for decades while inflation slowly exacts its insidious costs. The system that pushes forward fake politicians with movie star smiles, populist rhetoric and polished speaking styles, whose sole mission once elected is to maintain the status quo for the wealthy individuals and corporations that got them elected. The system that prints out of thin air and borrows from third world China and elsewhere trillions of dollars to bail out the wealthy while sending the bill the average taxpayer. The system that will produce, for the first time in the history of the United States of America, a current generation of young citizens who will be worse off than their parents were before them.
That’s what I think the protesters are all about and I support it 100%. Occupy Wall Street is creating the next economic punctuated equilibrium moment and I say the sooner the better.
Another protest of no consequence ?
Anyway, how does the All Blacks performance( win or lose) effect the mindset of the electorate in NZ leading up to their elections on the 26 november (about 7 weeks away)?
I’m thinking the incumbent’s hoping for a big win in a home World Cup.
Believe it or not Rugby is linked to national morale in NZ.
Get well soon, Paul. Your comments here are always appreciated.
The opposition organ is stirring the pot on a Labor leadership challenge again.
I don’t get it (but then, I didn’t get it last time either). Why would you challenge now? Wouldn’t you wait until the CEF package passes, and perhaps the pokies issue is resolved?
Get well very soon, Paul.
Yes indeed T Rudge … Do add me to the list of those wishing Paul a brief, minimally unpleasant and brilliantly successul therapeutic sojourn in hospital.
He is, as you may have gathered from the above, highly regarded in this place.
Well said Marisan – I think #occupywallstreet is something different. I don’t know where it will take us but it won’t be where we are right now.
Do we need something similar in Australia? I’ve had a stab at answering the question – http://wp.me/pb4Hp-5g
There is one reason, and one reason only why the OO and the rest of the Murdochracy want to feed ALP leadership speculation: They’re terrified that Gillard will succeed and defeat Abbott at the next Federal poll. Can anyone think of a better answer? Especially when one applies Occam’s Razor…
All the best Paul – thinking of you, and thanks to T.Rudge.
Yes, thinking of you Paul. Hope all is well soon.
T. Rudge – please send my best wishes to Paul.
Yes Paul Burns, make sure you survive the Expensive Scare Unit. Sounds serious, may not be, I hope. Best wishes.
PB, hope you will be OK. What obscure military history are you planning to read in the recovery ward?
Just want to add my best wishes, for Paul, ‘get well soonest’.
I also would like to add my voice to the “get well soon Paul or else” chorus.
Best wishes for a speedy recovery Paul Burns, hope you get properly fussed over (if you enjoy that sort of thing)
Best wishes for a speedy recovery Paul.
Best wishes, Paul
Get well soon Paul, best wishes mate.
This shitty Labor government are bringing welfare quarantining to Bankstown too:
http://newmatilda.com/2011/10/07/income-management-western-sydney
Paul, get yourself well very soon please.
Well, Les Coqs crow on while Les Rosbifs pack up their off field incidents and fly home. Rugby wins when England lose. Youthful Wales were mighty against the aging Irish. Two great matches with positive rugby rewarded.
New Zealand have received a boost with Ruchie declaring he can put his best foot forward and drag his gammy one after it. But the French victory will be dampening their rejoicing; they would have the England teams measure but the French can perform anywhere from F1 to 2CV.
Jess, despite Keys’ popularity an Australian or French World Cup win on NZ soil would cast a pall over the nation. Who knows whom the people might lash out at. There is no democratic vote for the All Blacks coach.
The weather in Wellington should favour the Wallabies against the Bokke and hopefully more positive rugby.
oh! A speedy recovery to you Paul!
Thanks T Rudge. All the best Paul.
Get well soon Paul, all the best, Eric.
Paul, get well soon – hope you are up and about soon and feeling much better.
AndrewL thank you for your concise and insightful match reports on yesterday’s games.
So it comes down to this. We must beat the Seth Efricans, the nicest and most loved rugby team in the world, because we can’t be sure the Argies will do the job on the ABs today, and nor can we sure that either of next weekend’s semi-finalists France or Wales would be up to it in the Final.
Paul: gutted to hear the health hasn’t been the best. Best wishes for a speedy recovery mate.
Best wishes to Paul Burns and thanks to T. Rudge for passing them on.
Thinking of you, Paul, hope your recovery is fast and painless.
Can anyone think of a better answer? Especially when one applies Occam’s Razor…
Yes. Papers need “news”, leadership speculation pieces basically write themselves, aided and abetted by grumpy backbenchers and idiots like Richo. It’s the beat-up par excellence. I’m sure destabilising Labor is just icing on the cake – there’s plenty of other stories to read about it in Fairfax etc.
Personally, I’m hoping South Africa win, but I’m biased in favour of the result that means less talk about football in my own cultural space.
How little you know or care about rugby, Fran. This is not about us.
It is about New Zealand.
It is about the necessary steps that we must take to prevent our rude little brothers from across the briny way becoming our insufferably rude little brothers for the next four years.
We can only hope that the Argentinians will do that this afternoon, but that is a naive hope, and if they do not then, should we not prevail this afternoon, we must trust in the Seth Efricans to do the deed next weekend and we can take no chances on that as should they fail our hopes must then reside in either France or Wales and those hopes are forlorn.
I know that you would struggle with (as you always do), and therefore do not expect you to be able to comprehend, the ethical dimensions of this but if you were to apply the utilitarian principle you would realise that the greatest happiness of the greatest number, to be secured by all ethical means, is for the Un Zudders to be deprived of their lust for rugby glory.
It would be better for them as well. They would be spared from the temptation of hubris.
In all fairness to our rude little brothers and sisters, Greg M, consider this recent news item.
Much as we love our little brothers and sisters, Fiona, and share with them in their travails we always must always look forward.
Consider these news items:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyclone_Yasi
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-01-16/brisbane-flood-volunteers-turned-away/1906674
Thinking of you Paul, get well soon.Much missed on this forum.
Thanks T Rudge for letting us know.
I suspect that although there are fewer NZ-edders than Aussies GregM, their happiness per capita at winning would be so much greater than ours, as to make their victory preferable even in utilitariajn terms. Apparently, most Australians don’t care about football and fewer yet care about Rugby Union. You can’t argue with polls — or can you?
I do admit to special pleading and a degree of selfishness in wanting anyone but Australia to win however. Oh … and some Schadenfreude as I suspect the bulk of those interested in Australia winning at Rugby would be folk I’d not choose to have as company while
sipping chardonnay orhaving caffes lattes. Anuthing that upsets Alan Jones or Tony Abbott can’t be all bad.oops {anything}
Yes, GregM, I do live in Australia, I do know that there were devastating floods in Queensland (also in Victoria and WA, by the way) plus a huge cyclone.
The death toll of the Queensland floods (2010-2011) plus Cyclone Yasi were nothing like as large as the death toll in Christchurch. Nor was the heart of a city destroyed.
That said, your point was?
Lighten up Fiona.
This is Saturday Salon.
We’re not meant to solve the world’s problems here.
Or even bring them up.
My comments from the second post on this Saturday Salon were clearly lighthearted and frivolous. Fran has taken them in that spirit.
You have not.
So get a life.
@GregM,
Saturday Salon is for discussion of anything, the world’s problems definitely included. Perhaps you are confusing it with the Lazy Sunday threads?
Let me belatedly add my best wishes to Paul B and my hopes for his recovery.
Just read an interesting interview with Malcolm Fraser on the theconversation.edu.au.
I’m guessing, based on yesterday’s performance, that a NZ France final is looking more likely than not. That’s going to be a grudge match – wasn’t it France that knocked NZ out last time?
The extreme alternative – Wales vs. Australia – is a scary one because it forces us to entertain the very real possibility that Wales would win. The only Northern Hemisphere team who I ever want to see lift the cup are the Perfidious Frenchies.
Did anyone else watch Jesus Camp on ABC2 last night.
It was one of the most horrifying shows I have ever seen.
I too wish you much strength and a speedy recovery Paul. Battling chronic illness with the courage and grace as you have for all these years shows your true character. You are in my thoughts.
Health, such a precious thing.
I haven’t been near a computer for a week, so I’d also like to belatedly wish Paul Burns a speedy recovery.
Perhaps Gillard will fancy Wales …
A very mischievous suggestion there Fran.
But let us consider the three possibilities.
Wales against France in the semi-final: yes.
She would hardly be human if she did not. It would be forgivable if she appeared in a red scarf with fresh, organic and bio-dynamic leeks stitched to it and sang Land of our Fathers at the top of her voice.
Against New Zealand in the final?
Well she would hardly be human if she did not compare the number of ex-UnZudders voting in our next general election and the number of ex-Welspersons.
Against Oz in the final?
I think she would know that the electorate would be planning a Pacific Solution just for her, not involving any island.
I suspect she’d flip on gay marriage or maybe even asylum seekers before backing Wales against Australia …
Then again, what she does in private may be another matter …
New Zealand isn’t that far from the SOWS after all …
Belated get well soon please for Paul B.
I want to see either Wales or New Zealand win the rugby. Like Fran, the people in Australia who generally support the Wallabies are people I consider ‘enemies’. But rugby is a people’s game in Wales and especially in New Zealand.
I don’t know anything about the sort of people who follow rugby in France. How did the French get into rugby anyway?
Is it just me, or is Nikki Gemmell a total BS artist with boring/ predictable stunts masquarading as “deeply honest” books about early middle aged shagging?
You’re probably right, Lefty E, although I was paying more attention to the steak I was cooking than Ms Gemmell’s interview last night to really offer an opinion.
Not just you Lefty E. Sadly overrated, maybe because she mines her ‘genre’ for maximum vacuous publicity.
Maybe us mere males just can’t chart the landscapes of the female psyche and fathom the depth of the passions running through the seasons of womanhood.
You might be right Adrian, my favourite Librarian and literary adviser mentioned she once ‘started’ to read Nikki Gemmell. However, if it is the ‘genre’, wouldn’t the publisher also have a hand in it? Given the current striving for ‘boons & mills’ popularity at your ABC, Nikki fitted the profile for an interview on the 7.30 segment.