[Via Rowen]. The Sydney Tele is making a big fuss about a classroom exercise which asks NSW high school students to imagine that heterosexuals are a discriminated against minority. The headline gives some indication of the tone of the story – School Sex Furore.
As well as the inevitable intervention by the ubiquitous Minister Nelson (wasn’t he once regarded as a compassionate wet Liberal? Never mind, leadership baton and all that…), the similarly ubiquitous “Education expert” Kevin Donnelly observes:
Education specialist Kevin Donnelly accused educators of “political correctness”.
Dr Donnelly must have a press release template for occasions like this.
Interestingly, Kevin has also weighed in (again) to the values in education debate:
Also included is a list of preferred values such as care and compassion; doing your best; fair go; freedom; honesty and trustworthiness; integrity; respect; responsibility and understanding; tolerance and inclusion.
While the definition of values education is uncontroversial, it begs the question: which and whose values? An added concern is that while the values listed are reasonable, they represent a motherhood approach to defining the ethical role of education.
The Federal Govermnent of course started all this, insisting schools would have their funding cut if they didn’t explicitly teach “values”. You’d have thought that all those values might have been instantiated through attempting to develop sensitivity in students to people with non-hetero sexual orientations. But, it seems that Dr Nelson has another sort of values in mind.
At least Dr Donnelly is honest. He’d like to do away with the list in favour of the values imparted by a liberal education. Funny, I thought a lot of the Western Canon was written by non-hetero people. Would Dr Donnelly police liberal education to ensure this isn’t mentioned? And that “political correctness” is excluded? I mean, some of the classics of Western thought actually talk about tolerance, civility and respect. I wonder what’s left of liberal in a selectively value-free liberal education? Nothing evidently that would prevent a “furore” every time the love that dares not speak its name does dare in a school.
Update: Ausculture Jess has been moved to write a letter to the editor on this issue.
You’ve missed the most important aspect as far as I’m concerned. Carmel Tebbut, the state education minister,
(married to Anthony Albanese whose federal seat of Grayndler forms part of Sydney’s gay electoral heartland) actually cancelled the program unilaterally after the Tele contacted her on the weekend: i.e. before the story was even published. Kevin Donnelly and Brendan
Nelson were predictable responders. Tebbutt’s reaction was unconscionable.
You’ve missed the most important aspect as far as I’m concerned. Carmel Tebbut, the state education minister,
(married to Anthony Albanese whose federal seat of Grayndler forms part of Sydney’s gay electoral heartland) actually cancelled the program unilaterally after the Tele contacted her on the weekend: i.e. before the story was even published. Kevin Donnelly and Brendan
Nelson were predictable responders. Tebbutt’s reaction was unconscionable.
I don’t know anything about Tebbut, Geoff – what’s her story?
I don’t know anything about Tebbut, Geoff – what’s her story?
I dont know about the timeline of tebbutts response. The “furore” however amounted to one complain from “a member of the community”, no parents or kids complaints, AFAIK. Even if the material was truly objectionable — one class, one school, one occasion. The morning talkback shows in Sydney almost completely left it alone which gives you an idea of what a beat up it was.
I dont know about the timeline of tebbutts response. The “furore” however amounted to one complain from “a member of the community”, no parents or kids complaints, AFAIK. Even if the material was truly objectionable — one class, one school, one occasion. The morning talkback shows in Sydney almost completely left it alone which gives you an idea of what a beat up it was.
It’s pretty clear even from the Tele article that the material wasn’t objectionable from any reasonable standpoint.
It’s pretty clear even from the Tele article that the material wasn’t objectionable from any reasonable standpoint.
What a beat up. I despise the Tele. Thank god I’m in Perth now and I can read that bastion of fair and truthful reporting, unbiased headlines, fact-checking and accuracy known as The West Australian.
Ok then, back to the classics! As a previous thread mentioned the Greeks, and what’s more classical than the Greeks, I think we should embrace the Spartan education system. Give ‘em all one robe and no shoes, don’t feed them enough so they have to develop wiles and cunning to obtain food, beat them regularly if they so much as eyeball you the wrong way. A couple of times a year take them into the wilderness and leave them there, so that they have to fight their way home.
Also, as they get older they should be encourage to form packs and go hunting non-conforming members of society every night. The Spartans has helots (slaves), we’ve got all those damn queue jumpers and dole bludgers and single mothers that we need taking care of.
Perfect, eh?
What a beat up. I despise the Tele. Thank god I’m in Perth now and I can read that bastion of fair and truthful reporting, unbiased headlines, fact-checking and accuracy known as The West Australian.
Ok then, back to the classics! As a previous thread mentioned the Greeks, and what’s more classical than the Greeks, I think we should embrace the Spartan education system. Give ‘em all one robe and no shoes, don’t feed them enough so they have to develop wiles and cunning to obtain food, beat them regularly if they so much as eyeball you the wrong way. A couple of times a year take them into the wilderness and leave them there, so that they have to fight their way home.
Also, as they get older they should be encourage to form packs and go hunting non-conforming members of society every night. The Spartans has helots (slaves), we’ve got all those damn queue jumpers and dole bludgers and single mothers that we need taking care of.
Perfect, eh?
“I don?Äôt know anything about Tebbut, Geoff – what?Äôs her story?”
Catholic upbringing, Left faction, elected to Cabinet in 99, moved to Education this year behind the deputy Premier Andrew Refshauge (who is her mentor). Ambitious and probably has her eye on the deputy leadership eventually.
Her reaction was classic Carr government: move swiftly to choke off the potential PR problem and placate wounded parties behind closed doors. But she announced her decision to pull the program (in ONE school!) before the Tele even published. It made her look like a scared rabbit rather than the bold, decisive image one suspects she was aiming to project. The whole thing was a total yawn and the Tele dropped the story when it failed to set talkback alight. She looks like a total tosser today.
“I don?Äôt know anything about Tebbut, Geoff – what?Äôs her story?”
Catholic upbringing, Left faction, elected to Cabinet in 99, moved to Education this year behind the deputy Premier Andrew Refshauge (who is her mentor). Ambitious and probably has her eye on the deputy leadership eventually.
Her reaction was classic Carr government: move swiftly to choke off the potential PR problem and placate wounded parties behind closed doors. But she announced her decision to pull the program (in ONE school!) before the Tele even published. It made her look like a scared rabbit rather than the bold, decisive image one suspects she was aiming to project. The whole thing was a total yawn and the Tele dropped the story when it failed to set talkback alight. She looks like a total tosser today.
Look what happens when you give the state control over schools…
Look what happens when you give the state control over schools…
I can’t see what the problem is. We have all been in (micro) situations where the majority are homosexuals. Shouldn’t students know how this might feel and how they might deal with it?
I can’t see what the problem is. We have all been in (micro) situations where the majority are homosexuals. Shouldn’t students know how this might feel and how they might deal with it?
Geoff is right, she immediately banned the “experiment” as a knee jerk so she could get her quote in the Torygraph. As a parent, the teaching method seemed fair enough to me. George Pell didn’t like it though.
Geoff is right, she immediately banned the “experiment” as a knee jerk so she could get her quote in the Torygraph. As a parent, the teaching method seemed fair enough to me. George Pell didn’t like it though.
Um, Andrew, who should have control over state schools if not the state? Genuine question this, really. It may not be perfect but it’s better than any of the alternatives I can see.
Um, Andrew, who should have control over state schools if not the state? Genuine question this, really. It may not be perfect but it’s better than any of the alternatives I can see.
FXH: but gays are bad! We don’t want to teach empathy and kindness and understanding because that would lead to people to have empathy, kindness and understanding! And it may send the message to LGBT people that it’s OK to be gay and then where would we be?
FXH: but gays are bad! We don’t want to teach empathy and kindness and understanding because that would lead to people to have empathy, kindness and understanding! And it may send the message to LGBT people that it’s OK to be gay and then where would we be?
I was going to post about this on my blog today but you beat me to it (and I had no time). This makes me sick. Look at all the recent media crap idolosing Graham Kennedy was and yet this would have been exactly how he felt most of his adult life.
I was going to post about this on my blog today but you beat me to it (and I had no time). This makes me sick. Look at all the recent media crap idolosing Graham Kennedy was and yet this would have been exactly how he felt most of his adult life.
Sorry for that garbled post (time to go home). I meant ‘idolising GK’…
Sorry for that garbled post (time to go home). I meant ‘idolising GK’…
I’m guessing Andrew would prefer that decisions about antidiscrimination ed. were left to some mythical market. Let’s all point at him and laugh.
I’m guessing Andrew would prefer that decisions about antidiscrimination ed. were left to some mythical market. Let’s all point at him and laugh.
I’m guessing Andrew was being at least partly tongue in cheek.
I’m guessing Andrew was being at least partly tongue in cheek.
True dat.
True dat.
If this has been a private school (and I think all schools should be independent of the state) the NSW government would not have been able to cancel the program, and presumably Dr Nelson would have been much more reluctant to offer us his opinions.
If this has been a private school (and I think all schools should be independent of the state) the NSW government would not have been able to cancel the program, and presumably Dr Nelson would have been much more reluctant to offer us his opinions.
Oh, I see Andrew. Thanks for that.
I still don’t understand how a purely private network of schools would work, how you would standardise testing and standards, and ensure that underprivileged children received the same basic standard of education as richer children.
Come to think of it, these are all issue with all sorts of education, but I feel the issues would be far greater with no government schools at all.
Oh, I see Andrew. Thanks for that.
I still don’t understand how a purely private network of schools would work, how you would standardise testing and standards, and ensure that underprivileged children received the same basic standard of education as richer children.
Come to think of it, these are all issue with all sorts of education, but I feel the issues would be far greater with no government schools at all.
So instead of cancellation subject to the whims of the NSW Govt, it would be subject to the whims of someone else.
So instead of cancellation subject to the whims of the NSW Govt, it would be subject to the whims of someone else.
Kate – The failure of the state to educate underprivileged children properly is one strong reason for eliminating the state’s role as an education provider (though not funder), and putting the children into a more competitive school environment where bad schools will close. As now, underprivileged students on average will have less invested in their education than students from middle class families, but at least they would get the institutional flexibilities and accountabilities of the independent sector. I think testing should be compulsory, at least on the basics of maths and writing, but again am reluctant to trust the state to deliver it, on content grounds and because like in NSW they will refuse to release the results.
Amanda – Who is more threatening, the people who run one school or the people who run 70% of schools?
It’s a curious thing about the Australian left – they moan about almost everything government does but still believe in it.
Kate – The failure of the state to educate underprivileged children properly is one strong reason for eliminating the state’s role as an education provider (though not funder), and putting the children into a more competitive school environment where bad schools will close. As now, underprivileged students on average will have less invested in their education than students from middle class families, but at least they would get the institutional flexibilities and accountabilities of the independent sector. I think testing should be compulsory, at least on the basics of maths and writing, but again am reluctant to trust the state to deliver it, on content grounds and because like in NSW they will refuse to release the results.
Amanda – Who is more threatening, the people who run one school or the people who run 70% of schools?
It’s a curious thing about the Australian left – they moan about almost everything government does but still believe in it.