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23 responses to “A beginner's guide to MMP (NZ election)”

  1. Michael S.

    I got 9 based on your explanation only

  2. BigBob

    9 here as well – so your explanation is a good one.

  3. Phil

    7 but I skimmed, interesting stuff and excellent explanation, I now feel smarter.

  4. thewetmale

    Scored a 7.

    Thanks for that explanation. I had previously tried to get a grips with MMP by reading the explanation on the government website. Perhaps i wasn’t reading closely enough that time and so read your article with more attention to compensate but i found your explanation much clearer and easier to understand.

  5. dylwah

    8 and it was a dumb mistake, i missed the ‘before’ in your post, thanks

  6. Rayedish

    I got 8 and and when I looked at the answers I realised that I had miss-read the first question (duh!) all the same, and pat on the back to you Deb for your comprehensive explanation and a pat on the back to myself and everyone else here- we seem to be a smart bunch – or are only those who got above average posting their results? : )

  7. M-H

    I got 7 – I’ve clearly been out of NZ too long! The average score so far is 5.5, so lots of people aren’t sharing their score. :)

  8. Idiot/Savant

    So, should I be doing a piece on coalitions then?

  9. minxy

    I got 10…. but I guessed the easyvote one, so I suppose that doesn’t count… interesting system…

  10. Deborah

    So, should I be doing a piece on coalitions then?

    Well, yes! Because that’s where all the interesting politics happens, but the coalitions don’t make sense unless you know how the house is elected in the first place.

  11. Geoff Robinson

    I suspect voters tend to think that the PR seats balance the single constituencies when in fact they have no significance except in substituting for the 5% threshold. I see the argument for the threshold but given that the single-seat requirement is so subject to manipulation it would be better just to have a lower threshold.

  12. Geoff Robinson

    Also is there now a convention that the party with the most seats gets first chance to form a govt? Why did the minor right parties go with Labour last time otherwise?

  13. stargazer

    just one little correction to a very lucid explanation, deborah:

    If a party doesn’t pass one or other threshold, then their party votes are discarded

    no, the votes aren’t discarded, they end up getting split across all parties based on the the final percentages of the party vote. so if ACT got 4% & no electorate seats, that would possibly benefit labour as they would get maybe 1.5% (depending on the final result) that they would have never otherwise achieved. ditto for national if the greens fail to get through.

  14. Deborah

    I don’t know about that, Geoff – I think that voters are very clear that by and large, the party vote is the one which determines the government. so they don’t have a sense of ‘balancing’ the electorate seats at all. It’s just that when it comes to determining exactly which candidates from a party get into parliament, the electorate MPs get in first, and then whoever else is needed from the list.

    The original recommendation was for a 4% threshold, which would yield 4.8, or 5, seats).

    I don’t know whether the ‘convention’ exists yet. The first MMP election led to weeks and weeks and weeks of negotiations beofre we got a government (National and NZ First). Everyone seemed to agree that the protracted negotiations were a bad thing, so in subsequent elections, minor parties have either made it clear in advance who they would go into coalition with, or have said that they would talk first to the largest party. That could change this election; the Maori party have said that after the election, they will hold hui (meetings) with Maori throughout the country to get a clear sense of who they should be going into coalition with. The Maori party could very well be kingmakers this time around.

  15. Mindy

    8 out of 9. Really good explanation. Thanks.

  16. Deborah

    Yes and no, stargazer. The effect of the threshold is that parties below it drop out, so that parties above it get more seats than they would have, had all the also-rans been kept in play. But in terms the actual way the seats are worked out, the votes cast for the also-rans are discarded. Elections.org.nz has the details on their FAQ page – it’s the second question down. [link]

  17. Idiot/Savant

    Geoff: Also is there now a convention that the party with the most seats gets first chance to form a govt?

    Some people (meaning: the party which expects to get more votes) are talking as if there is, and it is the stated preference of at least two parties (NZ First and United Future), but there’s no such convention. One might develop, but it will take a few more elections for that to happen I think.

    Stargazer: no, the votes aren’t discarded, they end up getting split across all parties based on the the final percentages of the party vote

    This is one of MMP’s myths, and like the myth of a second referendum, it is simply false. No votes are transferred or split. The votes of parties which fail to make the threshold are simply ignored. The mathematical effect is the same, but no votes are shifted in any way. The party you vote for gets your vote, and not any other.

  18. Sam Clifford

    Question 6′s first statement is ambiguous. I got 8/9.

  19. Sacha

    From across the Tasman, it’s looked as if parties game the system by getting one constituency MP elected and then getting a couple of list MPs even if they get less than 5% of the vote. It isn’t unusual for major party voters to elect a minor party constituency MP (e.g. the Greens or ACT) so that the parliament is more likely to have groups of MPs more aligned to the major party.

    This gaming might be able to be reduced if there was a threshold of 5% or 3 (instead of 1) constituency MPs elected, although it may just mean that the same games will happen in more constituencies.

    What do people think about this?

  20. Ben Raue

    Is there much discussion about possible changes to the MMP system, apart from those who simply want to return to FPP?

    I remember Rod Donald saying before the 2005 election that the Greens supported using preferential voting for local electorates. I’ve always thought that the threshold can be very arbitrary, giving 6 seats to a party with 5.00% and 0 seats to a party with 4.99%, whereas a preference system could give some room to move. Eg. parties below the threshold are eliminated one by one, starting with

  21. Ben Raue

    * the party with the lowest vote, and votes being redistributed until all remaining parties are above the threshold, then distribute the list seats. I prefer STV to MMP, but I think that would be much fairer and less arbitrary. It would also avoid the problem of people avoiding voting for parties close to a threshold out of fear that their vote would be wasted.

  22. Ben Raue

    I reckon it’s a good idea to make it 2 constituency MPs to pass the threshold (except for that one seat). It is much less arbitrary and more of a pattern. If you win one seat and less than 5%, then you can win up to one seat but that’s it. This avoids the problem of an automatic overhang, unless that party somehow wins a seat with less than about 0.8%.

  23. Sam Clifford

    I don’t see a problem with introducing preferential voting to the constituency seats. In fact, I think it’s what’s needed in Queensland to give people an opportunity to elect someone other than the two big groups of dickheads we’ve currently got in parliament.