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74 responses to “Saturday Salon”

  1. Jacques de Molay

    Frist!

    Good to see the people of Bankstown standing up to Gillard Labor over bringing in welfare quarantining into their town:

    Community groups in Sydney’s Bankstown are baffled as to why their area has been chosen to trial welfare quarantining – and concerned about the outcomes for vulnerable groups, reports Adam Brereton

    “Not in Bankstown, Not Anywhere”, a coalition of Indigenous and community groups, rallied in Bankstown’s Paul Keating park on Saturday in opposition to the Gillard Government’s plan to roll out income management in five “disadvantaged” locations across Australia.

    But given the ongoing criticism of the scheme, a question would be a more appropriate slogan: “Why in Bankstown, why anywhere?”

    How odious is this:

    Problems with the implementation of the scheme and the way assessments will be made have been under criticism for some time. An assessment of financial vulnerability results in compulsory quarantining of 50 per cent of welfare payments. The other compulsory criterion, child protection, results in 70 per cent of welfare payments being quarantined.

    But assessments of vulnerability are conducted on a case-by-case basis by Centrelink staff according to fixed criteria, which are so broad as to capture almost anyone in receipt of social security payments. For instance, the Newstart allowance of $231 per week is regarded as low enough to place recipients under financial stress as a matter of course, bringing them automatically inside the purview of the vulnerability criterion.

    Gotta love this:

    What should be obvious and what is admitted by the department is that the scheme itself does not inject funds into creating opportunities for communities, but instead spends money on compliance and assessment, with the majority of funds going “directly to the Human Services portfolio for Centrelink service delivery”.

    Figures calculated by the “Not in Bankstown, Not Anywhere” group put the $117.5 million budgeted to roll out the scheme nationwide at around $4500 per person, per annum, most of which will go to compliance and paying the wages of Centrelink staff.

    http://newmatilda.com/2011/10/10/why-bankstown-why-anywhere

    Go Gillard. I freedly admit I never knew Howard was a Lefty.

  2. Joe

    I agree Jacques, not a chance I’ll be voting for Labor this time round.

  3. Terry

    Prime Minister Stephen Smith? Seriously???

  4. tigtog

    Wet day for the Occupy Sydney crowd to begin camping out in Martin Place.

  5. Ootz
  6. Fran Barlow

    No 1 son came home safely from the UK on Wednesday, giving me a third chance to say woohoo! this week.

    I’ll pass lightly for the moment over his evaluation of life in the UK. Now that we are within the shadow of the dreaded Melbourne Cup, let’s simply put it under the heading prefer others. I now have an enlarged sense of the cultural context in which the Brown government went down in a screaming heap. I’m no more sympathetic to the whining of right wingers over “gubbmint” but I confess, I now understand somewhat more why such whining has currency. It does seem as if they’ve really got an enormous lot of stuff to do in changing how public service is delivered.

    That noted, he drew my attention to this series (Everything is OK) on YouTube. It’s a kind of YesMen style improv.

    It’s a cri de coeur against corporate culture and police state mission creep. It does bring another dimension to the discussions we’ve had recently about freedom of speech.

  7. David Irving (no relation)

    Thanks for the link, Fran. It made my morning, and reminded me of some of the sins of my youth.

  8. akn

    Just looove the 70% quarantine rule if you are ‘referred’ by child protection authorities. One more persecutory tool in the armoury of ritual humiliation that under educated young social workers can dish out to parents and children unfortunate enough to have come to attention. Better still is doing it by postcode. So much more administratively comprehensive and efficient. In the meantime, of course, the next time you see a two ton 4WD hurtle past you up the highway keep in mind that its more than likely owned by a business or a family company. But hey, whose counting benefits?

  9. GregM

    No 1 son came home safely from the UK on Wednesday, giving me a third chance to say woohoo! this week.

    I’ll pass lightly for the moment over his evaluation of life in the UK.

    That moment has passed Fran.

    But welcome back to No 1 son.

    So give us the goss. What is No 1 son’s evaluation of life in the UK?

    I’d genuinely be interested to know.

  10. sg

    For those of the LP Hivemind who’ve been following it, over at my blog I’ve just put up the last of my series of posts on John W. Dowers’ War Without Mercy: Race and Power in the Pacific War.

    This final post is the most controversial, maybe, since it’s about whether the allied decisions about terror bombing and atomic attacks were driven by the exterminationist and racist ideas they had about Japan at the time. I’m hoping I’ve phrased it so as to avoid a stoush, but if anyone’s interested in how a review of the propaganda of the war can change one’s view of strategic decision-making, it’s over there waiting for an opinion…

  11. Jacques de Molay

    Picked up Bjork’s new album today from JB, ‘Biophilia’ which came out yesterday and can’t wait to listen to it.

    For anyone that’s insterested this is the first single, ‘Crystalline”:

  12. Jess

    Just read a fascinating analysis of the “We are the 99% tumblr”:

    http://rortybomb.wordpress.com/2011/10/09/parsing-the-data-and-ideology-of-the-we-are-99-tumblr/

  13. Fran Barlow

    GregM

    1. I’ve noted your contributions over at The Drum on the climate change topics. Kudos …

    2. He said that he couldn’t imagine why anyone who had a choice would live or work there. He was particularly critical of

    a) The health/National Insurance system which in his view was expensive and ineffective
    2. The water — which apparently is not of comparable quality to our water here
    3. Taxation arrangements
    4. The behaviour of banks in the UK

    He showed me a pay slip with ₤2200 or so and ₤200 of national insurance. This covered dental as well (unlike with us) but this advantage was more apparent than real. You don’t get to see a dentist on short notice and it takes 2-3 visits, spaced at up to 2 months apart to get simple things done. Ditto with the doctor.

    Unlike us, they appear not to have heard of marginal tax rates. While peopl at minimum wage pay no tax, even ₤1 above it means you get your whole wage taxed. In his industry — he’s a chef — people would walk off the job when rahter than risk going into a higher tax bracket.

  14. andyc

    Fran @13: Interesting filial first impressions of the UK. IIRC, about a third of UKians want to emigrate, so he is in good company. On the specific comments:
    1. Yes, the NHS has been a mess for ages. One particularly interesting thing to do is to try to get prescription medication when you are travelling, or working away from home and cannot get to the GP with whome you are registered…
    2. Water quality depends on where you are, in the UK as in Oz. I doubt that Bottled Adelaide Water will ever compete with Evian, even though it has been through far fewer treatment plants than the stuff that comes out of taps in London (I prefer the latter).
    3. The taxation system is an unholy mess, but the Poms have heard of stepwise taxation brackets: look at the charts here. I suspect that his workmates are being confused/ill-informed. The National Insurance scheme is a historical anomaly that acts as a payroll tax and/or allows a substantial chunk of income tax to be called something else.
    4. Banks have their evil/idiotic sides here as well as there, but yes: British banks are not your friend, in general. Except the time that I needed to arrange an overdraft in order to emigrate… :-)

  15. andyc

    Forgot to add that National Insurance in the UK is not an analogue of the Medicare Levy, and has nothing to do with healthcare: it originated as unemployment/pension insurance, but to all intents and purposes is now just disguised payroll/income tax.

  16. sg

    Fran, good luck getting dental service under the NHS in the UK. Very few dentists provide this service and they are hideously expensive. I had a dental emergency in the UK and the cheapest I was being offered was “maybe” “just” 500 pounds for a root canal. After paying a total of $80 for a treatment and a cap in Japan, I was kind of shocked at that. Fortunately I worked at a health policy thinktank and they explained the situation for me. You just have to ring around every dentist in your area until you find one who provides the service on the NHS. I did this and got a high quality, free root canal treatment. No one I worked with had ever had this experience (of free dental care). You also can’t visit said dentist unless you live or work in their area.

    Also good luck getting any kind of service from your GP except a referral. British GPs are paid more than British specialists (on average) but literally the only service they provide is referrals to hospital. Unless you need a medical certificate; a GP refused to write a medical certificate for my partner because it “would not be an efficient use” of his time.

    The NHS is an absolute shambles. But then so is everything else in the UK. I once watched a Korean couple miss their stop on the train to Devon because no one could work out how to open the train door. The handle was on the outside of the door and there was no explanatory sign. There was, however, a sign telling you not to lean out of the door under any circumstances.

    I have also never seen anyone find their seat in a train in the UK without causing an argument. This is because of the counter-intuitive numbering systems they use, and the crazy way they assign seat reservations.

    Absolutely, the UK is a country that couldn’t organize a root in a brothel.

  17. Robert Merkel

    Is it just me, or have the Greens pulled off a pretty masterful piece of political jujitsu over the past couple of days on their supposed pokie “compromise”?

    If I’m understanding the proposal correctly, rather than forcing high-stakes machines to be fitted with the precommitment system, they’re proposing to simply ban high-stakes machines.

    Yes, I think it’s a terrific idea. Yes, it calls the clubs’ bluff on their silly “licence to punt” campaign. But if they manage to sell a more restrictive policy on pokies as a compromise – that’s a beautiful piece of spinning.

  18. Jacques de Molay

    NEARLY 100,000 dole cheats who failed to show up at job interviews have had their payments suspended.

    In a dramatic increase in the number of families involved in breaches under the new laws, thousands have had payments frozen since July 1.

    Breaches include failing to attend Work for the Dole appointments, or being so deliberately rude during job interviews that employers did not offer a job.

    Even valid reasons can now attract penalties in some cases if job seekers fail to tell Centrelink in advance that they cannot attend a meeting.

    But payments can be reinstated, with full back-pay in some cases, if job seekers agree to turn up for a “reconnection” appointment with Centrelink.

    The Sunday Mail has obtained new figures that show 93,682 payments have been frozen or suspended after job seekers were kicked off the dole.

    http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/bludgers-lose-dole-as-100000-cut-off/story-e6frea6u-1226167491759

    Putting aside the Ltd News hyperbole, given many dole recipients suffer from mental illnesses Gillard Labor should be absolutely ashamed of themselves continually going after the poorest & most vulnerable in society.

  19. Marisan

    Jacques de Molay

    As an involuntary user of Jobstart (Can’t find a job, too old, too experienced and too expensive. And not through lack of trying either.) I have noticed a disturbing trend with Centrelink since these measures were bought in.

    All of a sudden letters advising of an appointment with Centrelink have stopped coming. (Centrelinks answer is that ” WE say we sent it so you must have received it”) Same with emails.

    The only way to find out is to log onto their website. Now my next reporting date is at the end of November (Forget fortnightly) and my last appointment was given on 3 (Yes THREE) days notice AFTER my reporting date. So, to keep safe, I basically have to log in daily. I don’t have a problem with that but I wonder how many have had their benefits cut because they were totally unaware that they had an appointment.
    I also wonder if this is a semi official policy of Centrelink to save the government a few bucks.

  20. wantok

    Robert @17: I agree, the Greens’ idea on pokies is simple and probably effective. it seems that they would see machines limited to a maximum of a dollar a spin and a maximum jackpot of $500. The theory being, I believe, that the problem gamblers could still gamble all night but, at a dollar limit, they are not going to go broke.
    It always seemed that the pre-commitment idea was going to be expensive and somehow would need the machines in all competing venues to be networked so that a gambling addict could not just move from the footie club to the RSL when the ‘pre-commitment limit’ was reached at the former venue.

  21. Godfrey

    #OccupyWallStreet will lead to #globalchange and here’s why http://wp.me/pb4Hp-5u

  22. GregM

    Thanks Fran.

    I haven’t made any contributions on the Drum about climate change or anything else. Kudos to someone else I fear.

    I’m surprised that No 1 son would have required dental treatment in the UK for, from what I have observed from many posts by his mother, he would have been taught by the most caring of parents the best of dental hygiene. I am sure that the poor little bugger could never have got out of the front door to go to school without being lined up for a thorough toothbrushing inspection.

    Still teeth are tricky things and I expect he is of the age to be grappling with wisdom teeth. But he is very brave, or foolish, to front up to the NHS for dental work. “The Big Book of British Teeth” from the Simpsons sets out one’s expectations there.

    I am not surprised that he was disappointed by the water there. I remember it as tasting like distilled water, without flavour or character, as a great percentage of it was recycled (i.e. from the sewerage ponds) while our water comes mainly in limpid form from vast protected reservoirs with just the mildest touch of fluoride and chlorine or ozone to add to its zest.

    I hope that in addition to giving you joy on his return No 1 son is also contributing his culinary skills to the Barlow household’s gustatorial enjoyment.

    Cheers

  23. Chris

    Isn’t the Greens pokie proposal just a subset of Wilikie’s. I thought his legislation allows for $1 machines with no precomittment.

  24. Lefty E

    Its estimated that for every $1000 spent privately on ariconditioning, the public must pay $2000 in infrastrcture to meet the extra peak load demands.

    Think about that next time you hear someone whinging about the public susidising private solar: one reduces peak load,the other increases it.

    90% of projected price rises in power are a result of incrased infrastructure costs around peakload – not the CO2 price.

  25. Katz

    From AndyC’s wiki ref:

    [Exemptions to income tax]

    An Act of Parliament to protect the Earl of Abingdon and his “heirs and assignees” from paying income tax on the tolls on the Swinford Toll Bridge.

    Clearly a tax system devised by the Ministry of Silly Walks.

    Here is a pic of the Swinford Toll Bridge:

    http://www2.2space.net/images/upl_newsImage/1259865629.jpg

    It is almost 250 years old.

  26. Ian Milliss

    I’m wondering how the Libs think they are going to raise money for the next election when they are now saying they won’t compensate business for carbon offsets in the unlikely event that they repeal the carbon price legislation. I doubt if those silly old goats they brought in to heckle Gillard are really capable of funding much of an election campaign.

  27. Fine

    Nice result in the Caulfield Cup for me. I’ve got the winner Southern Speed with a couple of horses in the Melbourne Cup. So, hopefully I’ll turn a profit. Go Midas Touch and Lion Tamer.

  28. Robert Merkel

    Chris:

    Yes, Wilkie’s proposal allows $1 machines with no precommitment.

  29. Katz
  30. Fran Barlow

    GregM said:

    I haven’t made any contributions on the Drum about climate change or anything else. Kudos to someone else I fear.

    What a shame.

    I’m surprised that No 1 son would have required dental treatment in the UK for, from what I have observed from many posts by his mother, he would have been taught by the most caring of parents the best of dental hygiene. I am sure that the poor little bugger could never have got out of the front door to go to school without being lined up for a thorough toothbrushing inspection.

    Putting aside the hyperbowl that (and one or two other measures) was in force for the first 16 years of his life. After that, a degree of discretion crept into arranagements. He moved out of home at about 17 and from that point on, both his personal care regimen and his nutrition were entirely matters for him. He is now 27.

    He spent much of his stay in Bristol and said that if one wanted to avoid replacing a boiler every year or so, one had to buy some “water softening” machine for about ₤5000. He also remarked that it tasted “chalky” and that it was common for people to buy Evian to wash their hair in.

    On the culinary front he has already made us a very fine mushroom risotto — one of my personal favourites and on another occasion, a nutmeat vol-au-vent that was TDF.

    It’s an interesting thing, re-acquainting yourself with your children-as-adults. He wasted no time in seeking work and the other day was offered a day on trial at a hotel that was also doing catering. They’d offered $65k and a vehicle. He went along and then Gordon Ramsay-style (but without the excessive profanity) took out a clipboard with his own checklist and began to deconstruct their business operation. Within about an our he had decided that they were borderline clueless and this wasn’t what he was interested in doing. He got a phone call from the owner later who said he’d been advised to offer him more money, but he shrugged his shoulders and passed it up.

    I looked at his checklist and his notes and I was so impressed with the level of detail he was able to record. Really, it looked more like an audit. I suppose this is the difference between someone who knows how to cook and someone who knows how to run a commercial kitchen.

  31. GregM

    I looked at his checklist and his notes and I was so impressed with the level of detail he was able to record. Really, it looked more like an audit. I suppose this is the difference between someone who knows how to cook and someone who knows how to run a commercial kitchen.

    The child of his mother.

    You have every reason to be impressed by, and proud of, him Fran, as you are.

    There is goodness happening there.

    Best wishes to No 1 son and his mother.

  32. mediatracker

    @27Fine – Good judge Fine. Southern Speed was very kind to me as well but unfortunately I did not link it with the Melbourne Cup.
    It looks to be very promising as a stayer.
    Good luck with your double.

  33. andyc

    Jacques de M @ 18“Gillard Labor should be absolutely ashamed of themselves continually going after the poorest & most vulnerable in society”: Yes, but if looking macho is your priority, it is easier to pick on soft targets than to…show principle, or something.

    Marisan @ 19” I also wonder if this is a semi official policy of Centrelink to save the government a few bucks. There is plenty of circumstantial/anecdotal evidence that Centrelink and their opposite numbers overseas do indeed screw around with communications in order to avoid the risk of having to pay people anything.

  34. andyc

    GregM @ 22“…the water there. I remember it as tasting like distilled water, without flavour or character, as a great percentage of it was recycled (i.e. from the sewerage ponds) while our water comes mainly in limpid form from vast protected reservoirs with just the mildest touch of fluoride and chlorine or ozone to add to its zest.”:
    ??? Recycled sewage water tastes plenty chloriney, I can assure you. Apart from that, the water’s character, like most else in the UK, varies from place to place. NB: not all our reservoirs here are that “protected”, thinking of the damage done to Canberra’s supplies after the 2003 fires.

    Fran @ 30” He spent much of his stay in Bristol and said that if one wanted to avoid replacing a boiler every year or so, one had to buy some “water softening” machine for about ₤5000. He also remarked that it tasted “chalky” and that it was common for people to buy Evian to wash their hair in”.
    Bristol? On the Carboniferous Limestone. As on the Chalk, the aquifers are full of alkaline, calcium-saturated “hard” water that tastes “chalky” because it is full of guess-what. It does indeed clog up and destroy hot water systems pretty quickly if not softened, but apart from that is very good for the teeth and bones, and makes fantastic beer. So it’s not all bad. Oz always strikes me as a little deficient in Limestone Country.
    I was always happier with hard water than with the slightly brown, peaty,acidic stuff from off the granite in the wrong parts of Wales or Scotland, which dissolves any old lead plumbing that might still be around…

  35. andyc

    Katz @ 25 Thanks! One of the numerous interesting directions I was not game to go! :-)

  36. Fine

    mediatracker@32. MacDonald’s horses always do well when he brings one over. Look out for Perfect Punch in the Derby. He also has a mare currently at 301/1 in the Cup called Lalla Rookh. might be worth a $5 bet, just for fun.

  37. Ootz

    +1 @35 and pass me the popcorn please.

    Has anyone heard from Paul Burns? Hope all is well.

  38. Ootz

    +1 @29 pass me the popcorn please.

  39. jumpy

    I found this a bit shocking. The rise in the price of basic food in the last 10 years. The table at the bottom shows it best.
    http://www.fao.org/worldfoodsituation/wfs-home/foodpricesindex/en/

    Where will we be in 10 years from now?

  40. Fran Barlow

    Thanks GregM

    I guess this is the mother talking.

    I can’t really claim to be his author in this respect. He seems to have developed his skills and insight entirely without my help. He and I have very different ways of engaging with the world.

    He’s not political at all, but he seems to have an uncanny insight into what’s likely to work and what won’t in any situation and is simply brilliant at spotting problems and coming up with work arounds. Even at 17 I always fancied him as a successful entrepreneur.

    He didn’t get it from me, and I don’t think you can teach that stuff …

    OK … I think “Mum” has probably said too much … apologies all …

    It is great to have him home though. Now to get those teeth attended to …

  41. Jacques de Molay

    Not just staunchly anti-drugs & anti-fluoride but anti-abortion too:

    ANTI-ABORTION pamphlets published by MP Ann Bressington have come under fire for misleading information.

    Ms Bressington said she was funding the printing of 120,000 anti-abortion pamphlets to be distributed by a group who had contacted her office concerned about the practice of abortion in South Australia.

    The pamphlets contain graphic descriptions of abortion procedures and include a photograph of a dead foetus.

    Ms Bressington’s campaign comes as staff at the Pregnancy Advisory Centre face a 40-day vigil of protesters outside the Woodville clinic, which is understood to have unsettled staff and clients.

    http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/anti-abortion-pamphlet-furore/story-e6frea6u-1226168008888

  42. Paul Norton

    Fine @27, do you have any inside oil on why Lights Of Heaven has continued to blow out in the fixed-price markets for the Melbourne Cup even after an improved showing in the Caulfield Stakes? If a horse has ever blown out to $101 for the Cup after running third in the Caulfield Stakes it would have been before my time, and I can only speculate that word is out that something isn’t right with her.

  43. Chris

    Jacques @ 41 – Xenophon needs to choose his running mates a lot better if he’s going to get two quotas worth of votes!

  44. Fine

    Paul, I’ve heard Lights of Heaven is going to the Myer Stakes instead. That’s the Group 1 1600m race for mares on Derby day. I think she’ll be a better horse next year.

  45. Fran Barlow

    An interesting profile of Bob Brown here:

    http://www.smh.com.au/environment/the-most–man-in-australia-20111017-1lsle.html

    Despite being a Green I’d never taken the trouble to find out much about his background. I’ve always been more interested in policy than biography, but this article does affirm my impression of him as a man of unusual commitment to ethical principle, compassion and generosity.

  46. Ootz

    The BoM 2011-12 Australian Tropical Cyclone Season Outlook is out today. The Summary says above average tropical cyclone activity likely for the Australian region this season.

  47. jumpy

    Thanks Ootz. My new 4.4 kva gen inverter is in the post as we speak,may come in handy.

    I love this illustration ” previous cyclone paths”
    http://www.bom.gov.au/cyclone/images/qld/cyclones-eastern.png

    Even feels like a good wet this year, flying ants started yesterday ( billions of em) nice and early.

    And my dad said to me yesterday at golf ” the wattles are out early, the mullet must be roe d up” he seems to think thats a sign of a good wet season.

  48. Fran Barlow

    Some time back here at LP, I took a swing at some propaganda I received in relation to an NRMA board election.

    I was basically miffed at the business-as-usual character of the two candidates. The post ran in part as follows:

    There were two candidates and just for giggles I thought I’d set the bar low and see if I could determine if one really was worse than the other. One of them looked like a footballer (which as it turned out, he was because when I looked at the name, it was “Geoff Toovey” who IIRC was a half-back for Manly. The other chap, “Lew Stowe” was even less easy on the eyes but as it turned out, reading the CVs only made things worse.

    I decided to see if, parsing the lines, I could deduce anything of relevance in deciding what they thought about the world, or at any rate, anything a person who believed in equity and sustainability might find slightly more or less offensive. I have to say this really was like that South Park episode where Stan has to choose between two school mascots — a giant douche and a sh|t sandwich.

    {…}

    So you get to choose between a corporate type with ties to defence contractors who lives in a blue ribbon LNP seat or some guy who played footy and also wants to destroy the environment while appealing to people who have urban assault vehicles.

    In a follow up I received an email from Lew Stowe, who was upset at how I’d characterised him. In fairness I quote him in part:

    She suggests that I’m some type of Halliburton defence contractor, right-wing liberal party supporter, spook? The truth is that I am actually the opposite of all of these things, (except for the part about not being as handsome as Toovey but my wife digs me). I am a former American, came to Australia because of the crimes and human rights violation perpetrated by the George W. Bush administration, I vote Labor or Greens consistently, became an Australian citizen with my wife, (who is Swiss) and aligned myself with former NSW Police Commissioner simply because I used to work as an instructor for a company called “Northrop-Grumman” and decided to set-up a security consultancy here in Sydney with someone who stood for honorable conduct. I so not what she suggests that I just had to say something.

    I apologised to him for the swing at his looks, which was unworthy, albeit that it was motivated by the depoliticised but business-as-usual character of the campaign. I added:

    The problem really was that you said nothing in your blurb to signal that you were anything but some corporate spiv. That was really the point of my post. As you may have gathered, like most at the Pure Poison site I’m interested above all things in social justice and sustainable environmental policy above all things. Most of us could scarcely care less if you were tight with Peter Ryan (and indeed, those who did reflect on it might count that against you) or were some sort of security contractor. For the life of me I can’t imagine why you used what limited space there was detailing stuff that could have had no bearing on your capacity to author a better NRMA. I was forced to the conclusion that you were signalling the fact that you were a fully paid up trusty for the right. In effect you were saying — I’m just as rightwing as Toovey, if not more so. Even your country initialism has CIA in it. Maybe that was an accident, but if so, it’s surely careless.

    Let’s be clear. The NRMA has the reputation as the “let’s spend more money on roads” lobby. It’s seen by most on the left as only slightly less disreputable than the big miners or polluters. One expects the contest for the board to be contested mainly by reactionaries.

    So if you are really someone who is sympathetic to Greens policies — at least in relation to the kinds of thing we might say in relation to the NRMA you did a really poor job of signalling, because I looked really hard to find some basis for distinguishing you from the other guy. Again, that was my point. I found zip.

    You could have mentioned any of the key terms — sustainability, public transport, cutting pollution, road pricing policy — any of these might have been a hint that you were something other than a man in black from the military industrial complex who lives in the more expensive part of town. There were no hints.

    As it turns out, this complaint, while accurate, may have been contextually unfair. Astonishingly, it turns out that if you are running for the NRMA board, you aren’t able to say what policies you will be standing for, except by referring to things you have already done as a board member. To do otherwise is a violation of the latest Board devised rules, specifically 3.4(b)(iii):

    Candidate Information;
    (ii) subject to Election Rule 2(b), must not include an endorsement of, or refer to, any other

    3.4(b)

    Candidate, any candidate in a previous election of directors of the NRMA or the
    intentions, policies or objectives of any of them or of any organisation, Group or other
    body (whether not or formally constituted) which any of them supports or is, was or
    intends to become, a member of; and
    (iii) must not, either directly or indirectly, refer to the Candidate’s future intentions,
    policies or objectives in relation to the business and affairs of the NRMA Group should
    the Candidate be elected as a director.”

    This seems to me to be utterly outrageous, but if it’s so, then perhaps I can begin to understand. I wouldn’t have particiapted under those terms.

    That said, Lew Stowe did concede:

    my demographic is right-wing lower north shore voters with lots and lots of money. Nobody else votes. Not the Hornsby region, not the Northern Beaches, just North Sydney, across the lower north shore to Manly. So my only chance is to sell myself as “product” to that demographic.

    He may be a nice chap personally, and certainly his tone to me recommended that view. People make all soerts of compromises in doing what they think is right, and for all I know, he could be like that chap in the famous song insisting his intentions are good and asking not to be misunderstood, at least not by left-of-centre folks.
    Anyhow, in fairness to Lew Stowe, I just thought I should update the record.

  49. Fran Barlow

    Clarification: Lew Stowe had initially responded to my post at Pure Poison, hence the reference above)

  50. Mk 50

    I have finally found a reason to applaud something Obama is doing.

    “After five years of use under George W. Bush, drone strikes had killed around 400 suspected terrorists in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Under President Obama, in less than three years, Predators have killed more than 2,200.

    The program is suited to Obama’s “leading from behind” approach to warfare: killing out of sight, and therefore out of mind — and out of the news. So comfortable is Obama with this new way of war that at a White House Correspondents’ Dinner, the president joked about using Predators on would-be suitors of his daughters: “But boys, don’t get any ideas. Two words for you: Predator drones. You will never see it coming.”

    For Obama, the Predator drone avoids former candidate Obama’s past legal objections by simply killing suspected terrorists without having to capture them — and then to ponder how and where they should be tried. With a dead, rather than a detained, terrorist, civil libertarians cannot demand that Obama honor his campaign pledge to treat suspects like American criminals, while conservatives cannot pounce on any perceived softness in extending Miranda rights to captured al-Qaeda killers.

    Anti-war protestors demonstrate in response to American soldiers getting killed, but rarely about robotic aircraft quietly killing distant terrorists. American fatalities can make war unpopular; a crashed drone is a “who cares?” statistic.

    Still, there are lots of questions that arise from this latest American advantage. Waterboarding, which once sparked a liberal furor, is now a dead issue. How can anyone object to harshly interrogating three known terrorists when routinely blowing apart more than 2,000 suspected ones — and anyone in their vicinity?

    Predators both depersonalize and personalize war in a fashion quite unknown in the past. In one sense, killing a terrorist is akin to playing an amoral video game thousands of miles away. But in another, we often know the name and even recognize the face of each victim, in a way unknown in the anonymous carnage of, for example, the Battles of Verdun and Hue.

    Once the most prominent critic of the war on terror, Obama has now become its greatest adherent — and in the process is turning the tide against al Qaeda. And so far, the American people of all political stripes — for vastly different reasons — seem more relieved than worried over Obama’s most unexpected incarnation as Predator-in-Chief”

    Mk50
    Brisbane

  51. Fran Barlow

    This is pretty disturbing:

    http://www.news.com.au/world/shocking-scenes-as-passers-by-ignore-dying-toddler-2-in-chinas-guangdong-province/comments-e6frfkyi-1226169264770

    Putting aside the obvious indifference of passers-by I can’t but wonder what the camera operator was up to. If you see someone run over by a van, isn’t your first response to go to the person’s aid rather than record the indifference of others? So unless this was simply an unattended fixed camera, I’d like to know what that person was doing.

    I noticed that in the pile-on in letters at the link above there didn’t seem to be a lot of attention to that obvious point.

  52. Mindy

    @Fran

    I just read that disturbing article as well, on SMH, but they pointed out at the end of it there that there was a man prosecuted for helping an elderly woman a few months back because he apparently broke some government rule regarding helping accident victims. I haven’t had a chance to find out the rest of the story.

  53. Fran Barlow

    Not a great day for the Tea party

    350-400 people in a 13,000 seat stadium in that bastion of xenophobia and reaction, Arizona, is not a great look.

  54. Russell

    The things people will do to avoid having their book hit the remainder bin …. I see one Kerryn Goldsworthy will be Margaret Throsby’s guest tomorrow. All will be revealed. ABC Classic FM. Wednesday. 10.00am.

  55. Russell

    Just looking at the recent Senate report on ‘Recent ABC Programming Decisions’ and notice the abbreviation: BAPH States, which apparently stands for the Brisbane, Adelaide, Perth and Hobart states. I hadn’t seen this inelegant abbreviation before, but I can’t think of anything better … any ideas?
    Non-core states?

  56. David Irving (no relation)

    Russell, I don’t think there’s much risk of Dr Cat’s book being remaindered. According to the lad in Dymock’s, it’s selling like hot cakes.

  57. Mindy

    Russell I suggest you read it before slagging it off. It’s a bloody good read.

  58. Russell

    Mindy – I didn’t comment on the quality or readability of the book.

  59. Mindy

    So it would be going to the remainder bin because???

  60. David Irving (no relation)

    Russell probably wishes there was an emoticon for tongue-in-cheek round about now …

  61. Russell

    So it would be going to the remainder bin because … that is the fate of many a fine book. More a comment on the Australian audience, than the book.

    I’m sure the book will sell well in Adelaide, but unless it’s a tale of romance and war, with some recipes thrown in, I wouldn’t count on great sales in the other states.

    DI – no doubt there is an emoticon for everything, but they remain outside my expressive repertoire

  62. GregM

    Fran@51

    Putting aside the obvious indifference of passers-by I can’t but wonder what the camera operator was up to.

    The SBS report I have just watched says that it was CCTV footage.

  63. Down and Out of Sài Gòn

    I just learned about the whole affair from my wife – who is understandably furious. From the Australian:

    A man who identified himself as the same driver told local media: “If she’s dead, I may pay only about 20,000 yuan ($3200), but if she’s injured it may cost me hundreds of thousands of yuan.”

    And this is really fucked-up.

    The focus has shifted from the callousness of the passers-by to practical pressures that kept them from trying to help.
    Many remember a case in 2006 when a 65-year-old woman fell in the street and broke her hip. Peng Yu, 26, rushed to help, took her to hospital and gave her 200 yuan for good measure. She later sued him, winning an award of 45,000 yuan because the judge decided that Mr Peng’s gift was evidence that he had caused her fall.

    Since then the fear of litigation has increased. In June, last year, a man helped an elderly woman only to be sued for 100,000 yuan. By September the Ministry of Health advised the public not to rush to lend a hand to the elderly if they fall. The results of that advice are already evident. Last month in central Wuhan, an 88-year-old man collapsed in the street and was left to die because no one dared to help.

  64. GregM

    Down and Out that is just sad.

    Our own laws on stranger rescue are not easy. We have no Good Samaritan Law, as the French do, which requires them to come to the protection of strangers and protects them, except against the grossest of negligence, when they do.

    For us the law requires us to do nothing to help a stranger in distress, even though they might die without our help, whatever the social and moral (or as some would say, ethical), condemnation might fall upon us.

    If we were to intervene and make matters worse by doing so then, at law, we would be liable for the consequences.

    But I don’t think that there is a judge or jury in this country who would find, without the clearest of proof, that a Good Samaritan’s intervention was any evidence of guilt of causing the person who they had come to assist to be injured.

    It would be very sad for us if we were ever reduced to that way of thinking.

  65. Fran Barlow

    GregM said:

    The SBS report I have just watched says that it was CCTV footage.

    Yes I was hoping that was the case and was relieved when I heard that later.

    Still, it’s shocking enough as it stands. One of the passers-by was escorting a small child, whose eye was drawn to the fallen child, yet on they went.

    It is extraordinary that “Good Samaritan” laws don’t protect people acting responsibly there. Had the child been dragged a few feet to the left before she was run over a second time, she might have survived.

  66. Down and Out of Sài Gòn

    GregM and Fran:

    My wife talked with some friends about the episode – and it turns out Việt Nam has the same rules as the PRC. Damages are lower if you run someone over fatally, and higher if non-fatal. I have no doubt that calculation has contributed to a quite a few accidents in the country. There’s no Good Samaritan law as far as I know in either country, and they probably haven’t even come up with something like common-style Duty of Care.

    OTOH, I have not yet heard of people suing their rescuers in VN contra PRC, but I’m prepared to be disappointed.

  67. GregM

    Down and Out under Australian law if you ran over someone negligently and killed them you would be up for much lower damages, if any, than if you left them injured and disabled,

    Damages are meant to compensate people for their medical expenses, pain and suffering, loss of enjoyment of life and loss of earnings, including future earnings. Where someone is dead much of that is not relevant. Where there was the death of a child there might however be a claim for damages for nervous shock to the parents as being a proximate consequence of the negligent act.

    However with a death you would be up for criminal liability for culpable driving/ manslaughter rather than a charge of negligent driving.

  68. Helen

    Russell @58 – don’t be all wide eyed and innocent. You presented a bog-standard post-publishing radio interview as some kind of desperate attempt to keep a book out of the remainder bins. So of course here was no need to be all literal and obvious about it. Nasty, petty, and totally transparent mate.

  69. Down and Out of Sài Gòn

    If you or I or pretty much other Australian ran over someone, monetary damages would be the last thing on our mind. We’d be worried about spending serious time behind bars. Most of us would be remorseful and guilt-struck.

    In the PRC and VN, it seems less likely to be ‘done’ for running someone over. Sometimes that may happen because the drivers are utterly careless. Accidents are worse in the East. But something’s really stinking when the financial incentives are there to have another go at driving over a pedestrian, because you only clipped him/her first time around.

  70. Fran Barlow

    Yes … having studied Law of Tort (GregM & Dawn & Out) years ago I was aware, though in the case of someone who was an income earner and had dependents the costs go up.

    I’m also wondering what a 2 year old is doing out on the streets unattended. In our household, we make it our business to keep our cats and dogs confined to the premises (in part)* to ensure they aren’t injured.

    * also for environmental reasons, public nuisance etc …

  71. Fran Barlow

    Tonight on Channel 7 (Sydney, 6.30pm) Today Tonight will be running one of those “we’re being swamped by migrants” trolls. I saw the trailer last night and it was appalling on several grounds.

    Starting with “Sydney’s Population Explosion” and the comment “a new Aussie ‘arrives’ every 91 seconds and a graphic showing silhouettes popping up at high speed, it quickly morphed into a “swamped by foreigners” moral panic with “900,000 migrants knocking on our door”. {Cut to scenes of apparently Asian children in school uniform and then foreign flags appearing on the map of Australia.}

    How will this affect your job, your property and your future? … before going to a story on miracle diets or some such …

    This was textbook xenophobic trolling. I’m recording the show tonight but IMO we should be ready to act in concert to protest misrepresentation to ACMA and other relevant bodies.

  72. Zork

    I apologise for the non sequeter here, and the shameful cross promotion, but i was wondering if i could ask for a signature. if you do not care about climate change stop reading now.

    if so, good on you. the Australian Youth Climate Coalition is in the process of lobbying the Clean Energy Future Corporation, which was set up to replace 20% of Australia’s energy sector with renewable sources (which they say includes coal-seam gas). We want them to recognise that Australia needs 100% renewable energy, and that coal-seam gas, as it is sourced from non-renewable resources is some from of sick joke.

    Please show you care, and sign here; http://aycc.org.au/repoweraustralia/

  73. jumpy

    RIP Keith Williams.
    Only met him once, we spoke for about 10 minutes, nice bloke.
    It seemed to me that he wanted to share thing of beauty with others.

  74. Fran Barlow

    Twitter reporting Gaddhafi died of wounds during attempted capture.

    http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/2011/10/20111020111520869621.html

    Note of Caution: As Hamster Wheel notes, his son, Khamis, has been reported dead on at least five different occasions …