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44 responses to “This post brought to you by the letters N, B, and N”

  1. Envious, of Moreland

    Sigh. For only about $300,000 we could sell here, buy something similar a kilometre south and be in the NBN zone. I envy you people with your snazzy modern infrastructure.

    But not as much as Canburros envy anyone with ADSL2 :)

  2. patrickg

    Working from home is currently enabled in my job, but I feel technologies like this will render many offices obsolete. Already our office has converted many of its desks to hot-desks, and people only come in once or twice a week. Technologies like this will enable us to never come in at all, really.

  3. David Allen

    A lead acid battery! Wow.

    Alas, I moved to rural Vic so I’ll not get to see this. It’s 4g wireless for me eventually, I suppose.

  4. Dave Bath

    Pulse dial? Hmmm. Slightly more likely than being able to warble up a handshake (which would probably mean connecting at 128 bits per second)

  5. Darin

    At 100 Mbps, I’m wondering how fast my kids could use the standard 20GB on torrents. I’m thinking minutes.. Linux distros, of course ;) We’ve been with IINET for years. The pre-configure thing is a bit of a mystery. When we upgraded, the first modem they sent us didn’t and I had to configure it. When it borked the replacement modem did it all out of the box, barring security stuff.

  6. Chris

    Darin @ 5 – people on plans where they count uploads as part of the quota are going to want to configure their torrent clients very carefully – or they’re going to find themselves bandwidth limited for most of the month :-)

  7. Mercurius

    Well, they are clearly going to have to streamline their install process if they want to get this out to 8+ million homes!

    This is a Community Service Announcement proudly sponsored by Captain Obvious.

  8. Chris

    Mercurius – the installers will get much better with practice. I had one of the very early ADSL connections in my area and had to help the Telstra technician with how to use ftp. They’d taught them what to do but it was pretty clear they had little to no understanding of what they were doing!

  9. Mercurius

    Hot off the press — a memo circulated within NSW Dept of Education advising NSW public schools not to connect to the NBN…the ostensible reason being a “five-year fixed-price contract with Telstra” is in effect.

    Smells like a political fix to me!

  10. Patrickb

    So what’s the deal Robert, will my current ADSL modem do the job with a bit of re-configuring (perhaps a firmware flash) or is there another bit of kit involved. Current config is ADSL2+ modem in bridge mode to an ADSL2+ wireless router (4 lan ports). If I was to get the NBN box on the wall bit installed would I be able to configure my current kit to work with it?

  11. Fran Barlow

    A download from my university’s file server was at about 1.6 megabytes {bits} per second

    That’s more likely.

  12. Andos

    @Patrickb: I think your wireless router should do the job with the proper configuration.

    Instead of bridging the connection from your modem, the same cable should just plug straight from the router into the NTD. Then it’s just a matter of adjusting the WAN settings in the router (I believe).

  13. Fran Barlow

    Gosh … they lhey were untidy with their cable placement. I wouldn’t have accepted that at school.

    As you say though, they will get better at this as they identify all the problems, develop tighter procedures and train all relevant staff.

  14. Shingle

    Sorry but I think it is totally cool that they have allowed people to plug in their old steam punk landline phones. I’ll never give mine up.

  15. dexitroboper

    For anyone who wants to keep using a rotary dial phone, converters are available. e.g. This one

  16. m0nty

    Er no Fran, 1.6 MBps means roughly 16 Mbps, which is entirely possible on a 100Mbps connection.

  17. John Bennetts

    Mbps = megabits per second.
    MBps = megabytes per second.

    IMHO, Fran’s correction was correct.

  18. Andos

    I don’t think so, John.

    If not because the speed of 1.6 Mb/s (about 200 kB/s) would be fairly slow for ADSL2+, let alone fibre, then because Robert would most likely be judging the download speed of a file from his Uni server through the reported speed in his browser download which is always reported in MB/s… 1.6 MB/s is entirely reasonable on his 12 MB/s fibre connection.

  19. John Bennetts

    I believe that the term “byte” is essentially undefined.

    Various authorities, dating back to the 1970′s, define the byte variously as between 4 to 36 data bits and perhaps more, depending on the capacity of the processor being used to handle the data.

    On reflection, the original user may have used the term megabyte, thinking that it actually means something which, without further context and information, it does not, ie the fairly common but not yet ubiquitous 8-bit byte. Is there some kind of SI unit called the byte? Not that I can find. By itself, the term is either misleading or meaningless.

    Am I being overly pedantic, silly, or just plain wrong? Is there a modern standard definition of the data byte which renders my history lesson obsolete?

    And, if modern usage has it that a byte always and only means 8 bits, then what do I call the 32-bit string which a 32-bit processor uses? Is it a quadbyte? And 64 and octobyte?

    An analogy: In nature, an animal’s foot may have 1 (horse), 2 (cow), 3 , 4 or 5 (human) toes. We all know what toes are. To know how many toes are on each foot one needs to first know which animal is being discussed.

    Similarly with the number of bits per byte. What animal is being discussed?

  20. Andos

    I’m not entirely sure, but I think we may be missing the point here…

  21. Fran Barlow

    By convention, line speed is always documented in bits (thus the difference between the old cat5 cables at 100Mbps and cat6 at 1Gb), whereas storage is documented in bytes.

    Just for amusement, 4 bits (half a byte) is called a nibble. So the word size on your 32-bit processor might be 8 nibbles … ;-)

  22. David Irving (no relation)

    Further, I believe the correct spelling for half a byte is actually nybble.

  23. Fran Barlow

    No, DI(NR) — nybble is an alternative spelling to the most common spelling, nibble, which was itself expressly devised because of the homophone between byte and bite. Nybble more expressly links the term with the spelling: byte.

  24. Nick

    “Why would anyone ever want to count to more than 255 anyway?”

    It wasn’t really about counting to 255 though was it, Robert ;) Rather how many bits were required to reproduce the character set of a standard typewriter, plus a handful of other useful symbols. Even the earliest computers used 64-bit word lengths to store and calculate numbers.

  25. Chris

    John Bennetts @ 20 – you’d be pretty hard pressed to find a modern computer that doesn’t have 8 bit bytes.

    And, if modern usage has it that a byte always and only means 8 bits, then what do I call the 32-bit string which a 32-bit processor uses? Is it a quadbyte? And 64 and octobyte?

    I think you might be referring to 32 bit integers rather than strings (which doesn’t really make any sense). I don’t know of people who call them quadbytes etc – these days people would just talk about 32-bit ints or 64-bit ints.

    Robert @ 23 – And just to complicate things further I’d guess that you were measuring effective speed rather than the actual number of bits or bytes transmitted which would include all the network protocol overhead.

    Your university download experience does point out one rather significant issue. Its most often not that universities and corporations can’t get faster links (they already have fibre). The infrastructure is there if they want to use it. Its that they don’t want to spend the money to pay for the extra bandwidth. The NBN is not going to change that situation significantly.

  26. Chris

    Robert @ 29

    About the only time I max out my ADSL download speed is when I torrent :-) A much faster upload speed will be very welcome though.

    Extra bandwidth is not cheap and they’ll have to find the extra money from somewhere. I would not be surprised to see a combination of increased bandwidth (which Universities have had to do in the past anyway with the growth of ADSL) and some QoS. So “important people or faculties” get a higher priority on bandwidth than ordinary staff who in turn get a higher priority than students.

  27. Mercurius

    This is just like reading a slashdot thread, only in purple.

  28. Skeet

    “About the only time I max out my ADSL download speed is when I torrent A much faster upload speed will be very welcome though.”

    Probably the major portion of the benefits of the NBN will come from the vastly faster upload speeds.

  29. mranawhata

    Robert, thank you for a clear and fair description of your experience connecting to the NBN. It’s helpful to hear a real story with plenty of detail so I’ve forwarded a link to the activation guys at NBN Co. I expect they’ll find it interesting. I love the “grandma pack”!

  30. Martin B

    For further amusement, let’s have a debate as to whether I was referring to multiples of 1,000,000 bytes, or 1,048,576 (2^20) bytes

    Surely you would have reported mebibytes if you had meant 1,000,000 …

  31. Martin B

    Whoops I mean mebibytes for 1,048,576 of course.

    {/law of recursive pedantry}

  32. David Irving (no relation)

    Actually, Nick @ 27, early machines tended to have 36-bit words, which is partly, at least, because EBCDIC was a 6 bit character set. (Yes, I am that old.)

  33. Steve

    I agree that the process did not seem ideal, and I hope they get much better at it. However, in their defense, I would say that many, many people have had similarly fraught (or worse!) experiences in trying to get ADSL or ADSL2+ connected to the house over the last decade, it might simply be the case that initially setting up/ trouble shooting these connections is sometimes challenging. e.g.:

    - it took over 20 days to switch from a ADSL2+ account to an ADSL2+ with home phone account on TPG, and I needed to make a line account with telstra first before they could do it, which later then got cancelled. The telstra line took over a week because the technician had accidently wired our house to the townhouse next door, so we were getting their calls (20 days without internet OMFG!).
    - I remember once in about 2001 having to wait months for an ADSL connection because the exchange had no spare ADSL connections available at the time.
    - a friend at the moment is stuck with crap internet because: his house is pair-gain wired so cant get ADSL2+, telstra cable doesnt run in his street, and optus is saying that it will cost $3k to install a new pole and cable to their house, because his pool is in the way and they won’t install cable across a pool.

  34. Brett

    This is just like reading a slashdot thread, only in purple.

    In Soviet Russia, Natalie Portman imagines a Beowulf cluster of YOU!

  35. Nick

    DI(nr) @ 37, I was thinking of this guy…

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_7030

    And I have to admit I’m nowhere near that old, but I did see it at the Musée des Arts et Métiers when I visited Paris some years ago…highly recommend that museum for anyone visiting there, even just for its Metro station whose platforms walls are made entirely of copper! Kinda like walking into steam punk heaven.

    My only experience with mainframes was my mum plonking me in front of a terminal at work when I was little…she used to work for IBM before I was born, then later BHP which was then this was, and then for Workcover later on in life before she retired…a lot of SAS stuff for those last two, I think…don’t know what model IBM that was (this was early 80s), but that thing was basically my baby sitter for a good year or two. She could leave me there for hours unattended, and I remember her workmates popping in now and then to show me tricks to keep me amused :)

    I might have mentioned this before, but its a good story I like about my mum and me, so I don’t mind repeating it…one of many formative fun times in my life.

  36. Nick

    Which didn’t all take place in front of a computer, btw!

  37. Keithy

    Underpaid and Overtaxed
    Wed 14/12/2011 – 10:44
    Mr. Turnbull, the same applies to you as well, The argument for implementing WWAN technology should be backed up with solid, technical and industry established facts. For example, how would you address data packet loss (WWAN signal is burst transmission, not stream transmission)? How would you address LoS (rule of thumb- the more visibility of sky, the better your reception)? How many more towers are you willing to put up (and bear in mind these towers have an exclusion zone around them)? these are just a few questions a lot of people will be asking.

    Senatory Conroy- Snide remarks are not a sign of an intelligent person, its a sign that someone is far out of their depth. While your speeches are typed up by someone who may have a vague clue about the technology, better heads than yours or mine have dedicated their lives researching technologies around broadband communication, its worthwhile to have a chat with them. And also to show us the full justification of spending $36billion when we have a massive soverign debt.
    source: http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/410178/conroy_nbn_lecture_lacks_intellectual_rigour_turnbull/?fp=4&fpid=78268965 , comment 2

  38. Keithy

    Oh yeh, upload-speed is what defines the usability of the internet!

    MUSICIANS, for a sneek-peek example into upload-speeds power to transform this very earths culture, wonder in awe at what a world will look like after real-time-jamming becomes a reality!!!

    THE NBNS POWER IS VERY GOOD NEWS FOR AUSTRALIA AS A ONCE CLEVER COUNTRY AND TONY ABBOTT KNOWS ANY OPPOSITION WILL BE QUICKLY UNDERMINED BY A BASIC ‘FOLLOW THE MONEY’ STRATEGY AS EMPLOYED BY THE GENERAL VOTING POPULATION THAT WILL THEREFORE EASILY SELL LOTS AND LOTS OF PAPERS: HENCE HIS SILENCE!

    TONY ABBOTTS SILVER SPOONER BRIGADE LOVES THE NBN AND HE KNOWS IT!!

    MALCOLM TURNBULL AINT GOING OUT LIKE THIS SO LOOK OUT TONY ABBOTT!!! JULIE BISHOP WON’T BE ALLOWED TO CONTINUE FOR ANOTHER LEADER EITHER AS IT IS BEYOND THE PALE THAT THE DEPUTY LEADER HAS NO ROLE TO PLAY IN A DIRECTIONLESS PPOLITICAL PARTY!

  39. Keithy

    3Snow_Crash
    Wed 14/12/2011 – 16:52
    Someone should advise Mr. Turnbull that the ICT industry’s de facto broadband network standard is FTTH and is currently being rolled out worldwide.

    FTTN broadband networks are now being made obsolete as it is outdated technology.

    Google Maps shows the worldwide status in its
    A World of Fiber (to the Home) A collaborative map of fiber to the home deployments worldwide.
    ..

    SAME SOURCE AS #42 , LOL, BUT COMMENT 3, … DOUBLE LOL!!